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Crung Prime dude capcan is getting every hover every time because hovers are just 75 kmh, the broblem are not the hovers the dogs are now the problem with the new cab and firebug and where speed try to catch a dog with a capcan if he is going full speed can you, no you can't, but try hover with full speed.. 

I was playing pulsar and helios hovers long time, but try do win one on one with a dog with a skilled player.. The dogs are the cancer now I can play a dog but I don't want, we all now ho is playing dogs the most time the Aces.. 

I love hovers and I say yes we need to change some stuff but to slow down the speed wtf dude did you ever played hover in cw or high ps? If you have then you never would say to get them on 70kmh.. 

You can't balance the game if the devs don't play the game or if they don't se what they can change.

I don't want to say nothing against no body but I spent money in the game, and I se every time buffs and nerfs that go's just for profit for the devs, in the beginning the icebox was 700 coins and one mouth ago it was 1300, then they did what, nerf the typhoon to do less dmg why so that ppl spent more money for icebox, and to sell typhoon so that they lose coins like most of them did, now the icebox is 2200 coins, and the typhoon was going under 25K now its again 27k coins, firebug was 23K coins now its 27k coins, the game will never be balanced because we need to spent money for it so it's good to try to make some difference.. 

But in the end the game is there to spent money if it is all balanced then what why do I need to play cw why, what is meta, you will have no meta, why spent money if you can make every week 900 coins on just crafting.. 

The ppl buy coins and pack just because of cw to win to get uranium, so would ppl stop to play cw what then you can grind every week 900 coins and that good you don't need meta to do raids or pvp.. 

Why did the devs do this clan ranking sistem that if you are in 200 you get uranium, because they wanted the ppl to spent more money on the game.. The ppl se wow now we have chanse to get uranium bu I ned other build or fused cabin and then they buy pack that's how it works.. 

We play they get money that it balances will never be or something similar or if maybe they make cw just for dogs and hover, and just for spiders then the came can be balanced and the ppl will don't have to say we need this and this to change! 

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9 hours ago, Crunk_Prime said:

Hovers should not have their top speed increased at all. Hell I would reduce it further and cap it at 70kmh personally.

It really comes down to the acceleration which is almost instantaneous when compared to a wheeled/tracked build of a similar mass.

 

The high acceleration actually lowers the skill floor of hovers. You make a mistake and come to a stop; no problem, you'll accelerate back to your top speed almost immediately. I could even see a top speed increase for hovers if it comes with tweaks for acceleration. The reason why hovers are so "fast" is because they have no issues actually reaching that speed most of the time. That's not the case with wheeled builds where a craft with 100km/h top speed tends to go at around 70-90km/h most of the time.

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On 9/18/2019 at 4:58 AM, HammeredByNature said:
  • Lets bare in mind that hover builds are not indestructible.....
  • the map and team your with greatly effects the chances of winning or losing.... + the use of mics...
  • some posts are almost suggesting that every hover build comes with a win button.....
  • I've had my fair share of being destroyed and taking out hover, typhoons with a dual draco/spark bastion build...
  • my success depended on my level of focus and my teams...
  • the map we're on..
  • The opponents level of focus..
  • Whether the opponents builds are more suited to defeating the ones me and my team are using..
  • And the strategies being used to either attack or defend...
  • If they get nerfed anymore then they may as well be deleted....

 

Oh shutup. You aren't special cause you can use a condescendingly large font and type a bunch of words that mean nothing.

Hovers are overpowered for these reasons:

  • They cannot flip, AT ALL. With a carjack you atleast have to wait until you stop sliding on your roof to flip and sacrifice 1 energy. This gyroscopic stabilizer also makes hovers like xxxx terminators. You can blast 50% of the hovers off to the point where the builds center of gravity is hanging over the front, yet the hover doesn't drag on the ground. It doesn't tilt forward to the point where it can't point its guns up. All you do by blowing a hover apart is make it a smaller, faster target. If a spider loses 3 legs, its *****. If a wheel build loses half of its wheels, its toast. Every build will become incapacitated if its center of gravity is outside of its movement parts, hovers are immune to this. Hovers need to lose the vast majority of their gyro. They don't lose combat performance as they lose hovers, in my experience, they gain it. 
  • Linear Acceleration Curve. ZKWS and i do CW together and he runs an Aegis shotgun with 6 bigfoots. He cannot pursue hovers. If he starts to close the gap on a hover, the hover strafes over him and behind him, and is now 100m away while he is still turning around and accelerating. In fact more often than not, hovers have bumpers at the bottom of their hovers and so they ram his shotguns off.
  • Total damping of bumps. Try driving forward over uneven terrain at 75km/h while keeping slow turning guns pointed where you are aiming. If you time your shot poorly by a frame, your shots will go above or below where you are aiming. Hovers remove a lot of skill in shooting slow turning weapons accurately at high speed because they do not react abrupty to bumps. They ride like a Cadillac.
  • Very narrow frontal profile. The frontal profile of an unarmored CW sidehover can be as low as twelve blocks wide. They get bigger solely because of spaced armor. An unarmored spider build is at minimum 20 blocks wide. This is fine if hover build's resilience matched their maneuverability. But hovers are flying tanks that out tank and out maneuver spider builds

Hover builds are terminators that can have their front half blown off without losing combat effectiveness that are simultaneously more durable than the slowest builds in the game while being able to accelerate faster than wheel builds with light cabins and shotguns. They have the highest tactical advantage of any movement part due to their ability to evade attacks, porcupines, and wedges. 

I don't want to hear bs about Radar armor, spaced armor, etc. Hovers are still overpowered without these things. They can kite at high powerscore endlessly while being able to trade cannon shots with unparalleled effectiveness. I am completely fed up with fighting high powerscore hovers. In fact I can't even play >10kps because it is totally dominated by hovers. Not meatgrinders, not wheels, not tracks, not legs. 

Fighting a hover in CQC is also a complete nightmare. Because hovers guns are very close together, it is easy to pop a shot off and duck around a corner while still hitting both rounds. Cannon spider's guns are very far apart and this makes spiders an easy target for a cannon hover in CQC. As long as the hover does not come on your ground and get Kapkan'd, he has a tremendous advantage in a knife fight with a cannon spider.

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5 hours ago, Renamed71622 said:

Oh shutup. 

no need to start being rude because you disagree with what I said...

5 hours ago, Renamed71622 said:

You aren't special

No one is special on this forum :005j:

5 hours ago, Renamed71622 said:

you can use a condescendingly large font and type a bunch of words that mean nothing.

At least our posts have something in common then :002:

Large font is just easier to read.... not  condescending, maybe your just a little over sensitive...

5 hours ago, Renamed71622 said:

 

  • They cannot flip, AT ALL. With a carjack you atleast have to wait until you stop sliding on your roof to flip and sacrifice 1 energy.

some movement parts require more caution than others, Hovers have their con's as well as pro's...

After reading some of your little rant it seems that the movement part has somehow shoved a stick up your backside...

I also recall you moaning about a build that doesn't destroy them so easily or can't...

Guess what..... all builds have strengths and weaknesses...

If you or your friends build struggles against them.... do a little research and make a build that's more effective against them then...

It's what everyone else has to do with their builds....

My CW build with the bastion, dracos and spark isn't bad at all...

But it has weaknesses as well...

Limited speed....very limited angle for spark so i can easily get caught in kapkans, if i'm caught then im done for....

Typhoon stun lock can mess up my strategy a lot and I can't hit back since they are at a long range..

If my opponents have their kapkans very well placed then even my stealth won't save me....

And if someone deploys a turret shield or whatever it's called then it stops my build in it's tracks rather than destroys it since it's designed for wedging...

There are many other builds that have an advantage against me as well...

My point is you don't see me throwing my toys out the pram or making a song and dance about it....

 

Edited by HammeredByNature
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Personally I have one single problem with hovers and it's the high flip resistance. I don't care for their high acceleration and their speed could even be buffed if flip resistance is removed.When I look at hovers I see huge unstable reactors that should allow to fly above the ground. I don't see an immovable platform that can shrug off a tsunami shot.

In an other topic I talked about it : Different moving parts should serve different roles. Having a super stable build is done well enough by spiders (and tracks if lateral movment is not your thing). Hover steal their jobs by being too stable. If all movment parts have the same use, one will mathematically be better.

My solution is to remove entirely the flip protection but to buff speed and maybe even acceleration. Hovers could be well balanced as mobile engines of doom that fly fast without care about terrain at the cost of not being able to use high recoil weapons and risking being flipped by impacts and ramming. Flying fortresses are a problem not because they are too good but because they invalidate other movment parts.

Also removing auto balance would force to put the hovers outside of the build like every single other movment part are. Right now you can hide them in the middle and you build will still be stable for some obscure reason. Hovers would make much more sense as glass cannons than as flying fortresses IMO.

 

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1 hour ago, HammeredByNature said:

no need to start being rude because you disagree with what I said...

No one is special on this forum :005j:

At least our posts have something in common then :002:

Large font is just easier to read.... not  condescending, maybe your just a little over sensitive...

some movement parts require more caution than others, Hovers have their con's as well as pro's...

After reading some of your little rant it seems that the movement part has somehow shoved a stick up your backside...

I also recall you moaning about a build that doesn't destroy them so easily or can't...

Guess what..... all builds have strengths and weaknesses...

If you or your friends build struggles against them.... do a little research and make a build that's more effective against them then...

It's what everyone else has to do with their builds....

My CW build with the bastion, dracos and spark isn't bad at all...

But it has weaknesses as well...

Limited speed....very limited angle for spark so i can easily get caught in kapkans, if i'm caught then im done for....

Typhoon stun lock can mess up my strategy a lot and I can't hit back since they are at a long range..

If my opponents have their kapkans very well placed then even my stealth won't save me....

And if someone deploys a turret shield or whatever it's called then it stops my build in it's tracks rather than destroys it since it's designed for wedging...

There are many other builds that have an advantage against me as well...

My point is you don't see me throwing my toys out the pram or making a song and dance about it....

 

i mean sure i can build a low effort dog build with spears and one shot a hover, but that's not the point, requiring an arguably broken mechanic to effectively combat another broken mechanic is just dumb and refusing to address the issue.

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1 hour ago, HammeredByNature said:

no need to start being rude because you disagree with what I said...

No one is special on this forum :005j:

At least our posts have something in common then :002:

Large font is just easier to read.... not  condescending, maybe your just a little over sensitive...

some movement parts require more caution than others, Hovers have their con's as well as pro's...

After reading some of your little rant it seems that the movement part has somehow shoved a stick up your backside...

I also recall you moaning about a build that doesn't destroy them so easily or can't...

Guess what..... all builds have strengths and weaknesses...

If you or your friends build struggles against them.... do a little research and make a build that's more effective against them then...

It's what everyone else has to do with their builds....

My CW build with the bastion, dracos and spark isn't bad at all...

But it has weaknesses as well...

Limited speed....very limited angle for spark so i can easily get caught in kapkans, if i'm caught then im done for....

Typhoon stun lock can mess up my strategy a lot and I can't hit back since they are at a long range..

If my opponents have their kapkans very well placed then even my stealth won't save me....

And if someone deploys a turret shield or whatever it's called then it stops my build in it's tracks rather than destroys it since it's designed for wedging...

There are many other builds that have an advantage against me as well...

My point is you don't see me throwing my toys out the pram or making a song and dance about it....

 

 

"all builds are equal guys, they have strengths and weaknesses, its just my preferred build is more equal than all others. git gud lol"

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Notes the easiest way to deal with a hover, is a weapon that is niche as all get out, the TOW. seriously single hit removes a hover engine and if you hit light frames you can actually strip all but the 4x6 and 4x8 ones.

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4 hours ago, ZKWS said:

hOvErS aRnT oP tHaY hAvE lOw hP

kek

not really helping yourself with that post....

 

4 hours ago, ZKWS said:

i mean sure i can build a low effort dog build with spears and one shot a hover, but that's not the point, requiring an arguably broken mechanic to effectively combat another broken mechanic is just dumb and refusing to address the issue.

people keep using the word broken when if it were broken the movement part simply wouldn't work.... And my main CW build isn't using hovers.... it uses bigfoot wheels...

As I already said every build has a weakness... even hovers...

4 hours ago, ZKWS said:

 

"all builds are equal guys, they have strengths and weaknesses, its just my preferred build is more equal than all others. git gud lol"

another comment which won't get you anywhere....

I may have hovers but my main CW build is not using them....I use bigfoot wheels atm...

Maybe you should get yourself a heavy hover build and then you'll have a better understanding of what their weaknesses are...

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10 hours ago, Warbrand2 said:

Notes the easiest way to deal with a hover, is a weapon that is niche as all get out, the TOW. seriously single hit removes a hover engine and if you hit light frames you can actually strip all but the 4x6 and 4x8 ones.

So, a niche weapon/build/playstyle to take out a build that's capable of comfortably fighting a wide variety of builds? Classic.

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On 9/27/2019 at 12:45 AM, Crunk_Prime said:

Using a TOW on your vehicle just makes the game more difficult for both you and your team.

Resent gameplay begs to differ, you aren't doing as high DPS, but you are seaking out things to destroy. Focus wheels cripple hovers, and don't take a tow over 8k.

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I miss the fast hover glass cannons. Speed cap pretty much killed hovers for me. I liked the fragile and agile builds that were fast. Heavy hovers made Typhoon more powerfull than it needed to be too.

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16 hours ago, *Jomar_SL said:

I miss the fast hover glass cannons. Speed cap pretty much killed hovers for me. I liked the fragile and agile builds that were fast. Heavy hovers made Typhoon more powerfull than it needed to be too.

You can still have them agile, with 4 hovers... though only 1 player i seen doing it at clanwars level (jefedejefes on pc)

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On 9/28/2019 at 1:47 AM, Warbrand2 said:

Resent gameplay begs to differ, you aren't doing as high DPS, but you are seaking out things to destroy. Focus wheels cripple hovers, and don't take a tow over 8k.

I wouldnt take a TOW over 1 PS. If you see somebody using a TOW, they are a free kill.

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Realistically, if such a build got flipped, the hovers would push it down to ground with high power, enough to keep it flipped or even crush some top parts :)

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1 hour ago, KrissGO said:

Realistically, if such a build got flipped, the hovers would push it down to ground with high power, enough to keep it flipped or even crush some top parts :)

Ah you mean crushed like the weapons of wedges when they drive under a vehicle 2 times their own weight?

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Due to the fact hovers float so high most melee builds will need to build specific measures to make sure they're capable of taking hovers out. If they build a "normal" melee build that's capable of fighting anything else this will happen when they meet a hover:

 

Spoiler

 

 

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I've suggested adding more light epic wheels, but if that isn't far enough, here's something that's pretty wild:

Increase their power draw. If increased from 5/8 to 10/14, then a x6 Icarus VII (light hover vehicles) would have the equivalent power drain of 6 studded wheels (compared to 3 studded wheels, currently). A x12 Icarus IV (heavy hover-boats) would have the equivalent power drain of ~8.5 Bigfoots (compared to less than 6 twin wheels currently). For this to actually mean anything, they would need a non-linear acceleration curve...which every other movement part already has, to my knowledge.

Increase tonnage and decrease mass as well, as necessary.

A strafing epic having much less power drain than the lightest rare wheel in the game makes no sense.

Edited by DominusPericulum
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^^ It's a difficult math do well. You see the current power draws for some of the medium cabin based hovercrafts seems to work really well. The issue comes from the fact this low power draw from hovers works just a bit too well with Heavy Cabin+Colossus.

 

If you increase the power draw of hovers you'll actually nerf the Torero and Ghost-based hovers even more than the super tanky Echo or Icebox hovers.

 

One could either restrict hovers to 6 (not the first time devs would've done that) or we just need to come up with a bit more complex solution.

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So I've got an idea. Give hovers much higher tonnage, but make them set the cabin and engine's tonnage to zero. That way, if a hover loses thrusters, it loses much of its acceleration. Which equals no more hovers that have a cabin, two typhoons and a single thruster left and still has instant acceleration to max speed and full mobility.

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Let me demonstrate the distruptive power of a single hovercraft in otherwise hoverless game filled with land builds, none which have been specifically designed to take down a hover:

 

Spoiler

 

 

This is the reason why this game has become so stale. If you want to play this game competetively you got three options:

 

  1. Play as a hovercraft
  2. Play as a craft that's specifically designed to take out a hover (like a melee build etc.)
  3. Get rekt.

 

Craft. Ride. Get destroyed!

 

Choice is yours.

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1 hour ago, Spedemix said:

...or we just need to come up with a bit more complex solution

I figured out how to nerf Colossus for hovers but buff it for Tracks:

 

 

The Colossus is the main culprit. With the way cabin power is calculated Colossus actually works better with hovers than say, with tracks.

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Here's yet another of my over-the-top and excessive ideas:

Express top speed limitations for mobility parts as a percent of cabin top speed instead of a hard base number. Obviously, stats would have to be changed.

This would be a big buff to medium cabs, but could control heavy hover-boats without making light hovers worse.

Edited by DominusPericulum
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