ZERGOR

Raids are not fun: New raids ideas

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Right now many players don't play raids. The cost of raid ressourses are very high because of that.

Some people thus do the raids for the value of those ressourses but many find it a chore. 

 

I think that the main problem is simple: Long + Nonchallenging = Unfun.

Personally I love both PVP and Invasion and I loved chase before it was removed. And I think the reason is simple:

In all of those you can go straight to the target, try to destroy it at fast as possible while calculating risk to avoid dying in the process then go to the next. Targets represent a great challenge and meaningful choices: For chase, destroying the escort cost time but allow more safety. Same for waiting a few seconds for the weapons to overheat. In invasions and PVP you have to assess what the vehicle can do and try to find a weakness or a good angle of attack.

 

The huge problem in usual PVE maps is that they throw at you loads and loads of high health low menace minions. It's even worse at high PS because to "increase the challenge" parts have their health bumped up without changing much the base model. It takes multiple seconds of focus fire to destroy a single minion. And those aren't really a threat so it's just cleaning.

 

So my idea:

Make all PVE map have objectives that can be done fast with risks or slower and strategically.

 

Exemples:

-Remove all protect missions. Protecting a target is boring and frustrating. In case of moving targets you have to move at their speed. In case of a static one, waves are a really frustrating feature because you need to clean after each one (particularly those stealthy turret guys that just flee all the time)

Alternative: Maybe a complicated one to code but steal the truck could be fun if one of the players has to go in a circle at the start and actually take control of an (armed) truck. All the players could do it to avoid problems but any truck reaching the end would be victory. Of course keeping a few player with their normal car would probably be more efficient to defend the truck(s) (trucks are not heavily armed) but having 4 huge trucks try to race to the end could be fun if people want to do it that way (they may lose often). There could be a few gates that require destroying but other than that the main threat should be mobiles enemies attacking from all side that you can either try to outrun or to destroy as well as fortified static defenses and minefields.

 

-Tower capture: Again the waves are a problem.

Solution: Remove the generator part, only have the 2 towers. Both activable from the start. Towers would work like capture points (with smaller radius). Players staying near them would capture them. Both towers captured=win. Having a player capturing a tower would trigger a constant spawn of enemies that would rush to destroy that player. It's possible to capture both towers at the same time and multiple players inside the same capture zone would make it go faster. Enemies would also spawn faster. Each 1/3 capture would trigger a leader spawn to spice things up. The goal is to have a very fast capture time if you stay in the zone but the focused fire of a leader and multiple minions will probably make that hard. Leaving the zone to stop their spawning and deal with them before there is too many of them is a viable strategy.

 

-Steel cradle: Not horrible but the turret destruction and generator activation are both a bit tedious.

Solution: Have 3 leaders vehicles on the map (and a few minions to protect them). The leviathan slowly gains HP from 25% to 100% as long as those are alive. When it reach 100% or the 3 are destroyed the cage opens. If you are very slow you will face the leviathan while there are multiple leader vehicles still on the map. If you go too fast to destroy the leaders you may face a damaged leviathan but you may be damaged as well due to recklessly fighting the leaders.

Those solutions aren't the best, just ideas to push in a direction: Having faster raids where you can actually die if you go too fast. People want (or at least I want) a bit of pressure on them and managing risk is a good way to do that. If raids wake people sweat a bit like in PVP they will be played and liked.

 

 

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Suggestion opened up to gather more feedback. :salute:

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Since I can't get my thread to be aproved, I will leave it here for the sake or argumentation:

On 7/11/2019 at 3:54 PM, lucashc90 said:

Cargo Race and Heist were 4 minutes (and they were timed) but they were more challenging IMO. Bring the wrong tool for the job and you were done! It was a time that I actually had one build made specifically for each type of raid.

Nowadays you spend 10~15 minutes on a raid that is a almost guarantee to win and it is monotonous at best and you can do all of them with the same vehicle because the formula is basically the same (shoot waves of raiders, complete objective, rinse and repeat until the end of it).

If devs make them harder no one will play because no one wants to waste 60 fuel on a 15 min raid only to lose on the last couple of minutes (like it was with the "protect the truck" raids when they were more fragile). If they were shorter and cost half the fuel, even if they were harder, people would enjoy playing because they would actually risk something (besides spending 15 minutes in front of the PC for nothing) and be able to come back in 2~4 minutes for another try.

Since its always hard to appease everyone, maybe it is time to revive the old raids and make them cycle alongside the current ones even if it means they will give half the rewards (chase included). Half the job is already done since they already existed, just needing minor tweaks here and there to get on with the current builds of the game.

12 (or at least 9) types of raids to chose from hourly sure sounds more enticing than the same old 6 doesn't it? AND with the new "play raids with any number of players" feature makes it even more feasible.

 What do you guys think?

 

Edited by lucashc90

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Back in the old days i made a pretty in depth raid guide and I loved running em there were alot of different strategies you needed to use vs different faction. Now they all feel kinda bland. It's basically slow campy process when before it was like tactical speed runs and didnt feel like a chore. There have been some changes I like but more or less the bots either feel non threatening or they focus the objective (usually the truck in convo escort) way too quickly.

Also with the "challenges" shop with badges they raids rewards feel pathetic for the cost of gas. It's hard to even get 4 players in a lobby sometimes. I think players need to get more fuel so they can raid more or the cost of fuel per mission needs to go down. Spending 60 fuel for 5 electronic parts is barely a fair exchange.

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yesterday i make hard raid for electronics i got 7 or 8 with the  premium scaner and you need 750 to build an items on event ...and if you want lvl up a driver to lvl 15 you need 2000 that is very hard ... and sometimes are raids begin with 2 players and some join after it last time i played raid only with 3 player... 

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Good ideas i like them, i playing this game since launch and until this day i still playing pvp , clan wars and pve for weekly chelenges , i want to address one thing that really bugging me and i pretty much everyone in raids it's the horrific just terrible thing called bot hp SCALING , i do enjoy the main aspect of this game to create your own vehicle with lot hp and good strong guns BUT  sadly if i create powerful machine with high ps like 12k and i go into raids, the raid makes you feel like your gun dealing next to no damage like chord white machine gun, since bots have monstrous hp pool and shooting them is just no fun all they have is naked cabin with 8000 hp pool and blue weapon that deal 20x more damage then legendary or relict weapon , the raids discourage you from evolving your vehicle and forcing you to play on 6k ps with 4 vectors mg . So i want to make suggestion remove scaling from game , currently in raids there are only 3 faction to fight against so for each faction make 15 different bots with different ps, example i go to raids with 6000 ps i getting bots that have from 5500ps to 6500ps and bots using in game structural to accumulate they hp pool NO SCALING!!! and bot weapons wary depending on ps and again weapon hp and damage must be WITHOUT SCALING .

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I will say it a gain, and I will not waste my time elaborating this time one of two things:

 

1  turn them into asymmetric PVP

2 turn them into different types of survival, and the longer u survive the higher the reward, this way it will make sense to get and use fancy weapons

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raids are strange i got more elektonics for a loose then for a win sometimes on different raids check my screnshot ^^

10 min win 10 electronics after 4 min loose 13 that is so stupid i have no words for it ...

screenshot-191027-203212(44 4 128).jpg

Edited by Dein_Meister_xD
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Is that war for fire? Maybe you could cheese it then? Find the fastest time to earn 10 Uranium and keep losing it while farming ez elec.

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On 8/7/2019 at 11:55 AM, ZERGOR said:

-Tower capture: Again the waves are a problem.

Solution: Remove the generator part, only have the 2 towers. Both activable from the start. Towers would work like capture points (with smaller radius). Players staying near them would capture them. Both towers captured=win. Having a player capturing a tower would trigger a constant spawn of enemies that would rush to destroy that player. It's possible to capture both towers at the same time and multiple players inside the same capture zone would make it go faster. Enemies would also spawn faster. Each 1/3 capture would trigger a leader spawn to spice things up. The goal is to have a very fast capture time if you stay in the zone but the focused fire of a leader and multiple minions will probably make that hard. Leaving the zone to stop their spawning and deal with them before there is too many of them is a viable strategy.

I really like that part.

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