Woodyrojo

[Feedback] New faction parts, part upgrade and balance changes. + and -

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ATTENTION! The topic is created to gather all the constructive feedback regarding the changes and new features in progress. Please, leave your feedback only after you've tested the changes on the special test server. All the posts that are not made in accordance with the example below will be deleted!

EXAMPLE

These are the features I like the most:

  • .... (in brief)
  • ....
  • ....

These are the features that I don't like:

  • ....., because...
  • ....., because...

Conclusion: (brief constructive conclusion that sums up your overall experience)

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The New Weapons are awesome!

love the new rarity even though I think this will make inflation in the market.

radar nerf = good, but would have liked to see the limit a little higher.

sad to see the cabin rework not being added. This would have really made things interesting. But I do understand this stuff need to be fully tested and thought out before adding.

also so glad to see new drones! It’s nice to see you guys are trying to finish up the tech tree. We have many holes in the tech tree that need to be addressed, this is a good start.

Edited by RoughMonkey
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These are the features that I don't like:

1. Problematic old fusion compensation:

By creating such randomness into the already stable weapon upgrade set, tons of potential problem will happen, like a set of reloading weapon with different projectile speed (lolz), set of cannon with different recoil (guess what will happen to hover if you have two cannons with different recoil!), set of movement with different power... 

This just makes no sense, at least offer some ways for players to control it, like free reroll chances, or more directly, let us pick one from the remaining two, and roll the last one.

2. Ineffectiveness of Some of the New fusion upgrades

I don't think 20% impulse is as good as 10% reloading / 5% damage, what you need to do is to make them all effective and creat diversity, not to pick a best one on your standard and leave all others garbage.

3.Obviously insufficient Hover Nerf

You absolutely did nothing, come on! The situation is worse than you may think, especially in high PS, the acceleration indeed needs to be nerfed, and the flight height need to be lower more significantly.

4.Failure on tweaking Radar armor

By limiting the number, you admit that radar is a good armor. This is pathetic, don't do it, just keep the decor liked tweak and nerf the HP/mass ratio.

5.Potential balance risk of Legendary drone

This is a disaster, some weapon cannot even destroy the damn drones due to limitations on the elevation angle. Actually, its mechanism is interesting, but I don't think players should be allowed to fight effectively with minimum effort, this is disrespect towards players who practice and improve their skills.

6.Potential balance risk of new Energy weapon

Actually, I have no idea about their actual in-battle efficiency, like it looks like that the Plasma Drill is a pin-point weapon, although it has great damage with Photon, it is worth doubting if it can be aimed well. But I do believe that the Plasma cutter is doing a great amount of damage with Photon and heating device, not that good considering its somehow nice accuracy and acceptable range. As for the lightning gun, I currently have no comment due to insufficient testing.

7.The cancel of cabin tweak

It is actually the best chance I'm looking forward, a brand new start for us to overthrow the currently existing metas and create new systems, but you canceled or delayed it. feels bad man.

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Give typhoons reload speed.

And fix the hit box from Typhoons, they fall with a wind blow with the latest update......

-Debuff Reapers!!!! too much durability give them heat perk. now with the extra energy to heavy cabins they can use 1x radiatior.....

Where and when is the new faction coming out!

Add test server to consoles! we pay the same money too!!!

Thats whats matters now......:3_100_100:

For the rest im ok with new update coming out!

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hey dev nice work last test server scare me but this time this is really nice 

cons

(hulk) the paint  cover the entire weapon and that make the weapon ugly (the weapon as a good look without the paint)

the shape of the new cab, with this shape it should have way more mass to build something with a good looking

maybe adding more parts for the new faction

you say the fusion all ready done will have more perks but it didnt work on my test server session

goods

everything else

misc

please dont change too much the mass of the cabins (but this is not for now so...)

could be nice to add the possibility to place the cab on the side of a frame or under, it could be an easy change and could make the new cab more appealing

add more choice to were you can place the new cab and how you can build your frame 

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35 minutes ago, Woodyrojo said:

These are the features I like the most:

  • New faction
  • New Weapons
  • Anything new to play with

These are the features that I don't like:

  • The lack of attention to Tracks, and Meat grinder issues, because they're not imbalanced, they're just too glitchy to be playable.  I understand that you have a lot of new stuff you're working on, but I think maybe you tackled too much at once.  

Conclusion: New stuff is great, but please try to fix the glitches that ruin our experience with the old stuff.

 

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These are the features I like the most:

  • Radar limit - still can cover a car's backside with an extra bit of hitpoints, but with no way to abuse it.
  • New weapons - they are all really cool! The concept of the lightning gun is really interesting in particular :)
  • Negative mass upgrade perk turned into a positive one
  • You decided not to do the cabin overhaul (only the special cabins, but those changes are fine)
  • Introducing safe leagues again sounds nice - it will hopefully open up the possibility of earning uranium for more clans again

These are the features that I don't like:

  • The adjusted upgrade system is still nowhere near ideal
  • Not enough of a hover adjustment, but I care less and less every day at this point

Conclusion: Seems like there is no way to talk some sense into you regarding the upgrade system - PLEASE, really think about the way it is handled in regards to certain items, notably pack-excusive cabins and items. With other items I can understand it is intended as an endgame resource sink and that's fine. But Cabins are probably the most fused items in the game and also the most important to have upgraded. If you introduce more possible outcomes, players will ultimately try to fuse the cabins multiple times to get the desired outcome - which will drain those pack exclusives from the game. It already happens with the current system too - take a whale such as myself as an example, I have an Icebox 'Heavy lifting' and Icebox 'Hauler'. I had to Upgrade one of them twice since I got identical perks the first time. This consumed a total of 8 Icebox cabins. That means that besides me, 7 other players bought the pack but no longer have the cabins that have been completely erased from existence and they can't buy the pack again. This happens thousands of times, inflating the prices and preventing many players from enjoying the cabins they would perhaps like to. I think the best way to handle this is Either: Give players who own a pack craft any pack-exclusive item featured in the pack - limit this if need be - for example give every item a cooldown so once crafted, it can only be crafted again in a week or a month, does not matter. OR: Make upgrade items interchangeable within their respective categories - epic cabins can be upgraded using 2 epic cabins, Epic Autocannons with Epic autocannons (in respect to the Joule) And so on. -- This would make the whole system more streamlined and ultimately more healthy to the market and the game as a whole.

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the nerve of the big hovers in the side cabin is good, but it nerves even more the straight hovers, the simplest would be to put the hovers back like 1 year ago, 4 hovers and 90km / h, armor is speed , and for flame thrower rushes with 3 firebug or 2 firebug + 1 spark? these vehicles the one shot everything they approach, the spark prevents moving completely + prevents reloading guns, and the flames cross the whole vehicle, it would be good to put the medication at 5 points and the firebug at 6 points as the other relics, or else I want reapers and tsunamis with 3 energy points, porcupines ditto, 3pts> 6pts

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These are the features I like the most:

  • i like that useless upgrades like my recoil upgrade for the hammerfall will get changes, thx for that
  • radar fix
  • new 1X frames are amazing, thx 
  • reverting the cabin changes, this would have just made already dominant builds more powerful

These are the features that I don't like:

  • the lack luster hover nerf, the height was never the main issue, because it doesn't actually address the problem that hovers make 20 ton heavy cab vehicles faster that 8 ton light vehicles, i have noticed a acceleration nerf on the test server RN, i would like for that to go to live, but as you haven't mentioned it i assume it's not meant to be there, hence my criticism. 
  • Still No Booster Buff, Boosters are probably the most useless module for normal combat cars. there power is too low the fuel amount is far too low and their health is too low. and on top of that as per my thread here from 2 years ago, ten up votes no dissenting opinions and 52 out of 57 respondents said they would like a booster buff. and again its a very safe module to buff as it does not directly increase vehicle survivability for damage output. So please just buff the
  • Again, no proper buff to the adapter, and with this new nail gun its even worse cause the nail gun is better in every way. more health amazing secondary fire. more reliable dmg output, and easier to aim, and half the PS. give adapter +5 dmg and 180HP.
  • Also i hate that drone, it's impossible to reliably take down and does way to much dmg.

Conclusion: all in all im very much looking forward to this update, and if what i suggested was to be implemented, it would be damn near perfect. :)

Edited by ZKWS
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Things I like:

  • I like the new special rarity and the new special weapons we are getting.
  • I like that the cabin rework was pushed back, because I feel like it needed a bit more work. But I do hope to see it in game one day.
  • I like that we are getting a new faction but some of the weapons need a balance.
  • I like that there is a safety net in CW so newer clans can have a better chance.
  • The radar change. The idea that players have been suggesting for so long.
  • One square wide frames!   :D

Things I don't like:

  • -14% hover elevation isn't  near enough to fix the sideways hover spam problem.
  • I have sort of mixed opinions about the upgrade system. I like that we can get multiple perks, so a better chance to get better perks, but there are still a LOT of perks that are worse compared to other perks in its group.
  • The legendary drone. OP
  • Plasma cutter. OP. If you have an aurora 3 of them deals 743 dps.

In conclusion, mostly good changes, but some of them need some refining. A lot of the new faction weapons are not balanced at all. Legendary drone and plasma cutter are OP. I still believe the upgrade system needs work but I suppose it's better than the one we have right now. Sideways hovers still need some sort of nerf.

Edited by Megar_Potato
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What I like :

 - Everything that is not the legendary drone. It's all good, the new weapons have great firing modes and synergies.

What I dislike :


 - Everything about the legendary drone. Seriously, it's an abomination that should have never went past the design stage. Drones are making people run away from your game, spark is an antifun ultra-strong crutch that defines a whole side of the CW meta. DO NOT mix them for the love of god, give us an Aurora drone instead that will actually work as you say drones should work: A supplement to someone's arsenal rather than their main weapon.
 - Don't backpedal too much on the hover nerf. There's a reason why it gets abused by people: it's just too strong rn.

Edited by Clebardman
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I think the new parts are a great addition to the game however I think the hover debuff originally was on point as side way hover builds are yet still OP in clan wars and in the game in general. Just debuffing the flight thrust height is not enough IMO. The speed at which sideways hovers can maneuver is absolutely insane, perhaps maybe not as slow as you guys had it originally but I'd suggest perhaps a 10% debuff in sideways movement to keep it fair. The new pack was impressive to a point, the cosmetic add on's was definitely on point. Basically in a CW match the height in which a sideways hover makes no difference if it can still out maneuver as usual that is like a slap in the face of the ones whom obviously complained about it in the first place. I did not complain i just deal with it as the game is fun regardless, but I would agree the first change in the hovers you all presented was too slow, I'd minimize it a little less so its a fair medium from what it is now and what you guys/Devs proposed int he first place.

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I want a 12 energy bastion with buffed Tonnage. Heavy cabs are already **** at any powerscore where light cabs still have spare mass limit. A Humpback on a frame with 4 legs accelerates half as fast as a Harpy cab on the same leg build. Their power doesn't win them acceleration when they don't spam bigfoots. It doesn't give them extra pushing power when ramming or trying to pin another vehicle. The only place heavy cabs are worth a damn is at high ps where they finally get to spam wheels, legs, or hovers to get the health they need to make up for their slowness. I'm not looking forward to any updates that don't fix the broken and outdated foundation the games built upon. 

  • Broken balance between heavy builds and light builds in equal powerscores. Heavy cabs have no tonnage advantage but they weigh 4x as much, are much larger, and are much slower to accelerate to their horrible top speed, and they don't get 12 energy. Then these **** cabs are made better by these magically overpowered perks like what the Echo has? 
  • Broken movement system (Tonnage, mass limit, arbitrarily set power drain, magical engines whose only purpose is to spam more movement parts and get buffs to reloads. Its overcomplicated and has little basis in reality)
  • Broken movement parts (Tracks, Augers)
  • Broken philosophy of balancing the Radar Detectors with Cloaks and Oculus'. I can't play CW more strategically with the Doppler spam. And the only people that can avoid Detectors are wheel builds that drive 100km/h. Then you also have the broken asf Oculus which passively wallhacks me when I try to cloak to avoid radar and change position.  
  • Broken balance of skill/power in weapon classes (DRONES, FIRE, MELEE, LANCES, the nerf did nothing to keep lancers away who will show up once the new faction comes around)
  • Broken hitboxes (Guns are obstructed in steps of 10 degrees when their arcs are blocked, and the arc calculation seems incredibly clunky, Projectile weapons still cannot shoot through a 3 block wide gap, Adapters included)
  • Terrible monetization through the use of totally overpriced packs full of overpowered items (KAPKAN, BLIGHT, ECHO, ICEBOX, GRENADIER, FAVORITE, TORERO, GOLIATH, ELEPHANT)
  • Broken balance of armor at the equal powerscores (Lunatic armor spam in CW due to its mass efficiency, Steppenwolf armor spam by sealclubbers because of its powerscore efficiency. Also armor doesn't slow a vehicle down enough and its a total joke durability and weight wise. Let alone the fact that armor would need to have no powerscore if it were balanced properly)
  • Broken sound design (This is a game about giant technicals improvised from scrap, and I can't use engine sounds in any way tactically.)  
  • Broken map design (Ever fall off a cliff on the Bridge map into indestructible trees?) You then advertise the new Frostburn pack driving through a physics enabled wall. For ****s sake Hard Truck Apocalypse from 2005 had destructible map objects like fences and trees. It also had destruction stages on parts like crooked deflated wheels, deformed fenders, bullet holes. We just have some smoke and sparks.

If you aren't going to fix these issues just sell the game to a developer who will. Its 3 years later and the game still has ALL of these awful problems. Except there is more crap like the occasional op item for players to point at. Mostly stuff belonging to packs too.

And no, I'm not following your watered down feedback format. My problem is no longer the individual overpowered parts, but the philosophy of implementation which creates them. 

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Things I Like:

  •  New Frame Parts- Player creativity is a good thing to buff. I'm sure this will help players execute their ideas easier. I wouldn't mind seeing more focus on these kinds of developments. I would expect the new faction to bring more of these kinds of building blocks into the game, and that would be good, I think.
  • New Cab- It's nice. It doesn't appeal to me, but It looks like strong work. It's very handsome, I think. The art work is excellent. It's just not my speed. I think if I gave it some time it could grow on me (I'm like that), but I'm presently underwhelmed, and not inclined to want it. I prefer muscle cars, and I understand that there is already plenty of that. So hooray for new stuff, different stuff.
  • Radar Fix- Seemed like a no brainer, but Yay?

Things I Don't Like:

  • Yet Another Drone- Obviously, you knew better and did it anyway. What can I say that hasn't been said ad nauseam?
  • Pew-Pew- I have no interest in the new space-age, sci-fi laser gun, Star Conflict crossover, if that's what this is, but hooray for new stuff. I know others will appreciate it, but I don't care for it, and don't find them compelling, or exciting. I'm just not at all interested in these, but good for those who are. It's not that this simply isn't my flavor, I don't want to be in the same game with that, and I avoid those games out of a lack of interest. No hard feelings. Pew-pew.

Conclusion:

All this new stuff seems geared for well established players who are simply bored with their old stuff. I find nothing in this update particularly interesting as nearly none of it will effect me way down here at my level in a positive way. I'll be seal clubbed to softer audio (pew-pew)...and more drones?:fed014: At least they have to aim them, sort of. The new cab is nice. The new frame parts were probably overdue. So hooray for that, too. Overall, I'll say this seems like a lot of work. Somebody else will probably enjoy it more than I will.

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The lancer's guild still approves* of the update.

 

*Our only qualm is slight confusion on why the development team seems so unsteady. This is in regards to which direction they would prefer to take their efforts in improving the game.

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I like the radar change, I think this makes way more sense and all. Just one favor, please? Make it max 2. I know this might be a little more abusable, but not everyone wants to center mount radar, or be asymetrical. Running 2 radars, one on each side of something, mirrored, has been something I do from time to time when it is hard to fit a radar on my back end/top. This I feel is a legitimate use, so if possible I'd like to be able to still do it. However, the idea of this change is something I am behind, and even if it was only 1, I'd support that over radar spam.

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things i dont like: 

That new drone... it is just stupidly OP. Do you even understand how things works in your own game??? I dont mind you make legendary new drone. I dont play them, they are boring for me, but i dont mind it. BUT THIS IS B*LLS**T ... They need to ONLY follow theirs owner... like other flying drones.. not chase targets like this... with this new mechanics they are so much OP it is not even funny... 

I dont understand how you could think it would be OK. Do you play your own game?

Edited by Lukieee
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well that is the main problem with them. You just cant... they fly above you and majority of builds just cant shoot them. They either should just follow owner or be on wheels... this - flying and chasing target -  will be huge problem and what makes them so much OP.... you wont be able to defend yourself against them. Or run from them. 

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32 minutes ago, Lukieee said:

well that is the main problem with them. You just cant... they fly above you and majority of builds just cant shoot them. They either should just follow owner or be on wheels... this - flying and chasing target -  will be huge problem and what makes them so much OP.... you wont be able to defend yourself against them. Or run from them. 

Then maybe it'll be a good thing to have a machinegun buddy. This game is all about the rock paper scissors. If you could do it all, then there'd be no balance. Shotguns, machineguns, even melee dogs (using the spark), are all going to pretty much pop that drone out of the air in half a second. It's not OP, flying drones are a joke, and always will be. Just so happens this one MIGHT be strong against a single type of enemy, and you happen to be that type.

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These are the features I like the most:

  • New weapons look glorius. Both in model and in SFX/animation. :good:
  • New weapons are quite interesting in mechanics. (Charged shots, heating of parts....)
  • New high tech weapons..... I have been waiting for a long time to exterminate my enemies with gigawatts of energy. :006j:

These are the features that I don't like:

  • Please make fusion changes that not xxxx up anyone. The first test server would have ***** up newer players who would never have gotten a 14 % increase for their favourite parts. The new one however now xxxx up older players...... just dont do it.

    If you have to use this system (and I honestly question the need for multiple perks for a fusion) then you have to give older players a choice in what perk they get.... otherwise you will end up ruining a lot of fusions.
  • Again, I want to point out that fusion system should be reworked into a system of advantage and disadvantages but without the RNG. Higher weapon durability --> lower turret rotation speed and vice versa. More ammo = more explosive force. Higher cooling capacity = weight increase.

     
  • New drone might be good against hovers.... but I am sceptical if you can balance it properly without causing seal clubbing.

 

Conclusion: Bring those new weapons into the game. I cant wait for them. :good:

 

Rework the fusion system into a system of advantages and disadvantages without RNG. Scrap the current planned changes..... most people are not really interested in multiple weaker perks.

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47 minutes ago, The_Tennessee said:

Then maybe it'll be a good thing to have a machinegun buddy. This game is all about the rock paper scissors. If you could do it all, then there'd be no balance. Shotguns, machineguns, even melee dogs (using the spark), are all going to pretty much pop that drone out of the air in half a second. It's not OP, flying drones are a joke, and always will be. Just so happens this one MIGHT be strong against a single type of enemy, and you happen to be that type.

you really think this is ok? 

It will be much more terrible then it was when wheeled drones was OP before they nerfed them. Iam really not looking forward to see this in live game, when there will be 3 people with those. It takes zero skill to use them and they will rule. Just wait and see.. and after a week you will either understand what my point is and will hate them also or you will be using them. Or both... 

Edited by Lukieee
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- The new cabin and the nailgun look very good

- Radar change is good - this was the most simple and the best solution all along. 

- New drone is awful. This is literally the last thing the game needs, it will be worse than the grenadiers. The plasma cutter is beyond OP. Did you forgot to test it with photon and aurora?

- You should give perks to all "special" items. Now it is inconsistent. There is no logic in making some item more expensive (more than twice) to craft and leave the stats unchanged. 

- If you set the crafting recipes as they are on the test server, you have to increase resource awards to keep the market prices stable and to compensate players for the inflation. 

- When you figure out how to implement altitude changes for the hovers (it is obviously bugged in the test server), you could also increase the power drain and the powerscore - significantly. Those changes could resolve two of the biggest problems with hovers - "heavy hover tanks", which should not exist in the game, and seal clubbing in lower powerscores. 

- If you are implementing drastic changes to the fusion system, give us option to "unfuse" previously fused items. It won't be cool if turns out that we have spend thousands of coins for fused items that are now useless.

Edited by Philipotel
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-These are my favorite features:
New legendary drone, this is a new way of fighting. Developers, you are prepared for such a long time not to give up and compromise due to the opinions of some players!
Crossout needs it! The machine gun needs him! Don't worry about gunners! This is not "WAR THUNDER"!
Machine guns and Tesla can easily destroy them, and SCORPION can attack them by placing them at 90 degrees.
These are the features I don't like:
Cutting machine 4 electricity, no bullets needed, laser-like trajectory will be taken by the suspended player to bully newcomers
Summary: (The characteristics of the new camp are currently very interesting, please continue to work hard)

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