Bobbill12345

The call cabin is broken and plays a huge role in making drones OP

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The call cabin really needs a rework, in it's current state it just makes drones more of a crutch than they already are, it makes anything that's not a machinegun or shotgun helpless vs drones because due to the cab's perk they can't reliably shoot the droner because it has a free durability boost and a massive speed boost

Devs say they want drones to be a support weapon yet they release a cabin that clearly benefits from going full drone

Change the perk to: If drones are deployed, damage of non drone weapons is increased by 20%

This way there is a clear benefit from using drones as a support weapon and not going full drone

Do this and add a line of sight requirement, then annihilators will be far more balanced

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Nah, it feels good to shoot a droner with two typhoons, and deal 200 damage each time

Works as intended :good:

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1 hour ago, Bobbill12345 said:

The call cabin really needs a rework, in it's current state it just makes drones more of a crutch than they already are, it makes anything that's not a machinegun or shotgun helpless vs drones because due to the cab's perk they can't reliably shoot the droner because it has a free durability boost and a massive speed boost

Devs say they want drones to be a support weapon yet they release a cabin that clearly benefits from going full drone

Change the perk to: If drones are deployed, damage of non drone weapons is increased by 20%

This way there is a clear benefit from using drones as a support weapon and not going full drone

Do this and add a line of sight requirement, then annihilators will be far more balanced

"Support weapon" doesn't mean a support weapon to your build, it means a support weapon to your team.

Currently drones sit in that category quite nicely, you have to remember that this game isn't about 1v1 situations, it's about 8v8 and 4v4, drone builds are not front line brawlers, they take a really long time to kill their target and they really don't last very long, or do very well when they, and their drones are the primary target of an enemy team.

Your comment about machine guns or shotguns isn't quite right either, just about any weapon can deal with drones pretty easily, with a few exceptions for annihilators, and this is where the "support weapon" comes in, if you find yourself unable to target the drones because you're busy dealing with someone else, that's exactly what their designed for, they are an annoyance, but also very easily dealt with once you can target their drones, they don't do a massive amount of DPS compared to almost any other damage dealing build, but they do offer you the ability to support your allies, and the cabin's bonuses give you the chance to survive long enough in a fight to get your drones out at least a couple of times if your opponent is killing off your drones, then switching target to you, then back to your drones, instead of just focus firing the droners vehicle and ignoring the drones all together.

I actually think drone builds are currently one of the most balanced builds ingame and fit their role particularly well at this time, if you find that they are a struggle to deal with in a match, just consider that the droner could actually be another wedge shotgun ramming under you, or a sniping assembler build that you can't even touch, or a ramming build, or just any other full fledged DPS build.

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I drive around with triple annihilators and people shoot them down constantly. They die very easy now. Since they dont change positions as fast as they used to, people with turrets weapons have a much easier time shooting down drones over their heads. Most teammates will help shoot down any annihilators drones as well. The only people having trouble with them are almost always just meta babies with wide open exposed cabins, and stationary weapons that cant aim up or turn.

 

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10 minutes ago, Crunk_Prime said:

I drive around with triple annihilators and people shoot them down constantly. They die very easy now. Since they dont change positions as fast as they used to, people with turrets weapons have a much easier time shooting down drones over their heads. Most teammates will help shoot down any annihilators drones as well. The only people having trouble with them are almost always just meta babies with wide open exposed cabins, and stationary weapons that cant aim up or turn.

 

Yep, this was my experience of using Annihilators too, because they became so notorious as being op they became a real threat that a team would deal with quickly, you have to remember also with annihilator drones, that if the droner is behind cover, and their target is exposed, they will likely have an ally behind them in cover following them in that wont have anything to shoot at except the drones, and everyone wants those little buggers dead!

They are however great fun in their supporting role, if you can find a fight that's just kicked off and your buddy needs some backup, getting those annihilators on target gives them a real edge in the fight, the damage is pretty low, but constant, but that reduction in engine power is the killer.

Oh also, having an exposed cabin doesn't really make much of a difference, it's actually helpful if you have the 10% damage reduction fusion perk, the builds that tend to struggle against annihilators, caucasus, and sidekicks are the ones with low hp that depend on movement speed & spaced armour, which is beautiful because they pretty much hard counter hovers :)

Edited by Alice_Accord
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34 minutes ago, Alice_Accord said:

"Support weapon" doesn't mean a support weapon to your build, it means a support weapon to your team.

lol you realize that definition would make literally any weapon a support weapon, or wheels "support wheels". 

Feel like using some support wheels?

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34 minutes ago, xcai35 said:

lol you realize that definition would make literally any weapon a support weapon, or wheels "support wheels". 

Feel like using some support wheels?

Not true at all, there are 3 main roles that can be played in Crossout, Support, Front line brawler, or Sniper.

For instance my 3 Caucasus build on legs is very much a brawler, designed to front line, take damage, dish it back, stay in line of sight of the enemy and take a beating whilst it's doing it, a supporting ally when I'm playing this build is very welcome.

My Tsunami leg build is a sniper, it sits at the back and provides long range coverage of the map, it's like a support build in some ways, but not quite, i try to keep other snipers busy to cover my close range brawler allies as they get closer, but I'm not a 1v1 brawler and rely on brawlers/support builds to keep me safe.

My Annihilator build is a support build, it has 3 Annihilators and zips around behind my brawler allies providing them with drone support, dealing light damage compared to them, but also messing with their targets engines giving my allies an edge.

My Incinerator build is a hybrid between support & sniper, it doesn't have the range or solo ability to win engagements on it's own against dedicated snipers or brawlers, but if a front line brawler has someone pinned, it can melt their target in a few seconds, alone however it doesn't do too great.. again support build.

My Draco build is a brawler, it's designed to find and destroy slow heavily armoured targets quickly, i'm usually first into battle with this build, and so it's very much not a support build, but when someone comes with me and has a spark/annihilator drones it's a great support to me.

My Barrier build is 100% a support build, it's designed to assist my allies by giving them shielding from ranged attackers.

Are you starting to get the picture here?

Yes all builds can technically be support builds if you use teamwork, which is how it's meant to be played and what leads to victory, but there are some builds/weapons that are specifically designed to provide your allies with an edge in combat, annihilator drones, barriers, sidekicks, grenadiers, turret builds..

In a 1v1 scenario between a shotgun build and a drone build, who do you think is gunna win? The shotgun build almost 9/10 times, because it's a brawler, fast, heavy damage, and can take a beating, the drone build isn't designed to be the primary focus of the enemy because they just destroy it's drones then it's defanged, and it will die.

Edited by Alice_Accord
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1 hour ago, Alice_Accord said:

In a 1v1 scenario between a shotgun build and a drone build, who do you think is gunna win? The shotgun build almost 9/10 times, because it's a brawler

So....does losing to shotgun build make drone a support weapon? If so, shotgun build will most likely lose to a lance build, does that make shotgun a support weapon?

1 hour ago, Alice_Accord said:

fast, heavy damage, and can take a beating, the drone build isn't designed to be the primary focus of the enemy because they just destroy it's drones then it's defanged, and it will die

In fact many drone carriers are using melee build chassis now, with 25% higher cabin power than a humpback and 30% damage resistance and a classical wedge these drone builds can win most 1v1 against non-melee/shotgun/mg builds, even when fighting mg builds they could cause bunch of problems simply by ramming. Also, annihilator isn't the only drone, after several nerf in a row grenadier still outdamage impulse in terms of dps per energy, and despite their lower hp they actually have longer cumulative life expectancy becuz apparently they can grow back within 20sec for a couple times thanks to cheetah bigfoot combo. In conclusion, a properly built drone carrier can go pretty much anywhere a melee build can go, the reason you dont see them fighting at melee range is, well, they don't have to risk that while their drones doing all the hardwork for them. If a build with frontline ramming and decent damage dealing potential can be qualify as a support, then 80% of all builds are essentially support builds.

Edited by xcai35
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I like that change for the cabin perk 

 

Even personally I don't have much issues with the cabin or the drones in general... It's really cute to see one drop all the drones, anihilate them with IMP's, and chase the guy while he is running in despair, not even being able to get into cloak because of a non stop bullet rain :lol:

BlankUnsightlyCony-size_restricted.gif

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31 minutes ago, xcai35 said:

So....does losing to shotgun build make drone a support weapon? If so, shotgun build will most likely lose to a lance build, does that make shotgun a support weapon?

In fact many drone carriers are using melee build chassis now, with 25% higher cabin power than a humpback and 30% damage resistance and a classical wedge these drone builds can win most 1v1 against non-melee/shotgun/mg builds, even when fighting mg builds they could cause bunch of problems simply by ramming. Also, annihilator isn't the only drone, after several nerf in a row grenadier still outdamage impulse in terms of dps per energy, and despite their lower hp they actually have longer cumulative life expectancy becuz apparently they can grow back within 20sec for a couple times thanks to cheetah bigfoot combo. In conclusion, a properly built drone carrier can go pretty much anywhere a melee build can go, the reason you dont see them fighting at melee range is, well, they don't have to risk that while their drones doing all the hardwork for them. If a build with frontline ramming and decent damage dealing potential can be qualify as a support, then 80% of all builds are essentially support builds.

You totally missed the point I was raising, I feel like it was quite a good explanation too...

No, losing to a shotgun build doesn't make drones a support weapon, the fact that they are external to the vehicle, easily blown up when focused on, and require the vehicle to constantly be mobile, therefore not able to hold ground effectively, and are usually retreating from a situation when presented with a threat, rather than attacking, means that they are a support weapon.

Using a ram front line build with drones doesn't mean it's not a support weapon, it means that it's a wannabe brawler, it's still gunna have to keep moving if it want's those drones to come back quickly enough to be effective, and anyone worth their salt is gunna blow the drones up quickly, which means it can't hold ground well, whilst a shotgun, cannon, caucasus, flamethrower, rapid light machine gun, melee build will hold ground well.

You can keep trying to force your opinion on the matter, but it doesn't change the facts, drones are a support weapon, they are not going to beat MOST brawler/front line builds if it's a 1v1 situation.

And most drone users put a ram on their build because it means when they do their driveby they have the chance of flipping the enemy/doing some damage, again they have to keep moving and retreat from the fight to let their drones do the work, otherwise they will end up losing their drones, and then not able to launch them again, that makes them... much better as a supporting weapon..





 

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The way you define the classes in the game, is about defining where and how the fights take place, and what each build role is in that fight.

Take for instance the train yard level, the fights are often in choke points, which means you have brawlers brawling in the middle, snipers trying to pick off anyone in the brawler fight they can if they aren't being engaged by another sniper, support builds trying not to get engaged by brawlers, but also being in the fight and close enough to help the brawlers push through.

This is the nature of combat in Crossout, there are different roles that each weapon/build takes..

Edited by Alice_Accord
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38 minutes ago, Alice_Accord said:

This is the nature of combat in Crossout, there are different roles that each weapon/build takes..

qft

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1 hour ago, Alice_Accord said:

easily blown up when focused on,

by 30% of the weapons in crossout, while other weapons will spend so much longer time dealing with drones that the build itself will take magnitudes higher damage than the damage it can deal to the drone carrier. 

1 hour ago, Alice_Accord said:

usually retreating from a situation when presented with a threat

If that happens too often it means you're engaging the wrong target. There are like 1/3 of all player builds that you can confidently engage in a drone build to secure a safe solo kill, and another 1/3 that you can put out a lot more damage than received by your own build in a 1v1 scenario, leaving only 1/3 of builds that you should avoid because engaging them will most likely result in a net loss. I don't think you realize the full potential of drones.

1 hour ago, Alice_Accord said:

whilst a shotgun, cannon, caucasus, flamethrower, rapid light machine gun, melee build will hold ground well

cannons are hopeless against drones, reload shotgun and flamethrower actually fall in to the second category (out-dpsed by drones thus it's always gonna be a net loss for them as long as you don't get harpooned).

If this holds:

1 hour ago, Alice_Accord said:

No, losing to a shotgun build doesn't make drones a support weapon

Then the fact they're not going to beat brawlers in 1v1 is irrelevant.

1 hour ago, Alice_Accord said:

but it doesn't change the facts, drones are a support weapon, they are not going to beat MOST brawler/front line builds if it's a 1v1 situation

 

Being capable of support doesn't mean drone is a support weapon, because they can do much more than support. In fact the least thing a weapon can do is to support, and if you're clueless enough you can play literally any build like a support build, all you need to do is to not engage when you should. Your reasoning is like defining a battleship as an aircraft carrier becuz it carries 2 seaplanes.

Edited by xcai35
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3 hours ago, Alice_Accord said:

For instance my 3 Caucasus build on legs is very much a brawler, designed to front line

also, how well does this brawler perform against other brawlers?

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7 minutes ago, xcai35 said:

by 30% of the weapons in crossout, while other weapons will spend so much longer time dealing with drones that the build itself will take magnitudes higher damage than the damage it can deal to the drone carrier. 

If that happens too often it means you're engaging the wrong target. There are like 1/3 of all player builds that you can confidently engage in a drone build to secure a safe solo kill, and another 1/3 that you can put out a lot more damage than received by your own build in a 1v1 scenario, leaving only 1/3 of builds that you should avoid because engaging them will most likely result in a net loss. I don't think you realize the full potential of drones.

cannons are hopeless against drones, reload shotgun and flamethrower actually fall in to the second category (out-dpsed by drones thus it's always gonna be a net loss for them as long as you don't get harpooned).

If this holds:

Then the fact they're not going to beat brawlers in 1v1 is irrelevant.

 

Being capable of support doesn't mean drone is a support weapon, because they can do much more than support. In fact the least thing a weapon can do is to support, and if you're clueless enough you can play literally any build like a support build, all you need to do is to not engage when you should. Your reasoning is like scoring 90/100 in an exam will get you a C becuz you get a C if you score over 60/100.

You're focusing on 1v1 scenarios, this game isn't a 1v1 game, it's a team game, and within a team each member has a different role they play, unless everyone is uniform in their purpose and function.

Football: defender, attacker, goal keeper, left wing, right wing, striker.

American Football : Quarter back, Running Back, Wide Reciever, Tight End

Rugby: Full-back Wing. Centre. Fly-half. Scrum-half. Number Eight. Flanker. Hooker. Prop.

Crossout: Brawler, Support, Sniper

All are team games, all have different roles to play in the game, the drone carrier is not a brawler, it does not brawl, it is not a sniper, it does not snipe, what does it do..?

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2 minutes ago, xcai35 said:

also, how well does this brawler perform against other brawlers?

Pretty good as long as it's not a wedge shotgun...

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2 minutes ago, Alice_Accord said:

You're focusing on 1v1 scenarios, this game isn't a 1v1 game, it's a team game

 

2 minutes ago, Alice_Accord said:

the drone carrier is not a brawler

So being able to solo kill enemy while circling around them at close range isn't brawling, what qualifies as brawling then? Does the build need to grow a pair of arms to brawl?

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3 minutes ago, Alice_Accord said:

Pretty good as long as it's not a wedge shotgun...

doubt it..

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4 minutes ago, Alice_Accord said:

what does it do

it drops drones to brawl

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6 hours ago, Bobbill12345 said:

The call cabin really needs a rework, in it's current state it just makes drones more of a crutch than they already are, it makes anything that's not a machinegun or shotgun helpless vs drones because due to the cab's perk they can't reliably shoot the droner because it has a free durability boost and a massive speed boost

Devs say they want drones to be a support weapon yet they release a cabin that clearly benefits from going full drone

Change the perk to: If drones are deployed, damage of non drone weapons is increased by 20%

This way there is a clear benefit from using drones as a support weapon and not going full drone

Do this and add a line of sight requirement, then annihilators will be far more balanced

Wait i got this , changed roles : if you can't deal with drones then you are bad at aiming , # crybaby 

Stop using hover and get spark , is super against drones and if you don't want to use spark then you don't want to adapt to the gamplay so again crybaby . Sry but i had too say this because this is what you guys say to us when we write something about hovers :)

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Easiest fix to annihilators?
Make them work like normal sparks and not aimbot for the cabin and give em 3% more slow to compensate.

Done.

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6 hours ago, Crunk_Prime said:

I drive around with triple annihilators and people shoot them down constantly. They die very easy now. Since they dont change positions as fast as they used to, people with turrets weapons have a much easier time shooting down drones over their heads. Most teammates will help shoot down any annihilators drones as well. The only people having trouble with them are almost always just meta babies with wide open exposed cabins, and stationary weapons that cant aim up or turn.

You forgot about people who think that they can take the entire enemy team alone and rush to their demise only to die alone and complain here later.

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8 hours ago, Bobbill12345 said:

The call cabin really needs a rework, in it's current state it just makes drones more of a crutch than they already are, it makes anything that's not a machinegun or shotgun helpless vs drones because due to the cab's perk they can't reliably shoot the droner because it has a free durability boost and a massive speed boost

Devs say they want drones to be a support weapon yet they release a cabin that clearly benefits from going full drone

Change the perk to: If drones are deployed, damage of non drone weapons is increased by 20%

This way there is a clear benefit from using drones as a support weapon and not going full drone

Do this and add a line of sight requirement, then annihilators will be far more balanced

Yes bobby i knew you had some brain cells XD

i agree 100% ive been thinking for a while maybe nerf the cabins tonnage and mass limit since drones are so light droner builds have way to much armour.

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also i'm pretty sure the annihilator drone speed nerf effect goes through aegis even tho it should be blocked with the dmg 

cant rly verify that tho

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1 hour ago, ZKWS said:

also i'm pretty sure the annihilator drone speed nerf effect goes through aegis even tho it should be blocked with the dmg 

cant rly verify that tho

I don't think it does, I ran an Aegis in my annihilator build for a while and when someone tried to counter me with their drones i could just shield up and outrun them.

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