Bobbill12345

"Ofc devs are monetizing the game, they need money"

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6 minutes ago, Firerfly said:

There is no such thing as a free ride player. Without them, we would have a low population. And games like that die out. A player who loves a game enough to pay for it, depends on these 'free riders' as you call them more than they depend on him. If they ware not the life force of the game, there wouldn't be a free to play game in the existence. Be happy they are here and respect them for that. 

She is not disrespeting them, she is just pointing out that some people that haven't spent a dime in the game acts like they are the bosses of the devs and shaming others for spending money on the game while being over demanding  and trying to shame devs into submission. Its already wrong if a paying player do it, being a F2P player and do it even more is worse imo.

Edited by lucashc90
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15 minutes ago, Firerfly said:

Be happy they are here and respect them for that. 

Look.  I have gotten no respect from these very specific players I'm talking about.  They know who they are. 

Not the "Free ride Players" in general.  It's a free to play game, and I have immense respect for anyone willing to slog through the grind with nothing but a handful of coins at the end of the day.

I have no respect for the "You don't play Clan Wars, so STFU, Ace" Klan, regardless of how much money they spend, but they've been calling "Cash Grab" ever since Gronchmass, when we got free stuff, for free.

Just don't look a gift horse in the mouth, and respect is like love.  You have to give it to receive it.  

Edited by psiberzerker
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28 minutes ago, psiberzerker said:

Look.  I have gotten no respect from these very specific players I'm talking about.  They know who they are. 

I have no respect for the "You don't play Clan Wars, so STFU, Ace" Klan, regardless of how much money they spend, but they've been calling "Cash Grab" ever since Gronchmass, when we got free stuff, for free.

There we can agree.
 I myself don't play Clan wars no more. Not my cup of tea. I also don't play high PS. And I have seen 'STFU ACE' jerks on both of these as well as with those of 'my kind'. The players who love low PS and do not play clan wars. Bad apples are found in every basket. 
Like you said, one should give respect to deserve it. That is why I am against categorization within the name 'free riders' (though it sounds cool for a faction name). Puts all the apples in the same basket. And I am one to advocate for the fact that free players should get rewarded just the same as any paying player. And deserve rewards. They DO make the heart of the game tick.

39 minutes ago, lucashc90 said:

She is not disrespeting them, she is just pointing out that some people that haven't spent a dime in the game acts like they are the bosses of the devs and shaming others for spending money on the game while being over demanding  and trying to shame devs into submission. Its already wrong if a paying player do it, being a F2P player and do it even more is worse imo.

None of us are bosses to the devs. Paying or not. If you pay, no one is forcing you to. If you don't pay no one is forcing you to play the game at all. I have heard much more whip lashing from paying players who are unhappy with what is going on with the game. Free players (I used to be one for a good while) have just as much right to complain about being unhappy. 
But those who spit curses and death wishes are equally to blame on both sides.

So I will say it's wrong to state that a F2P player is even more worse when he lashes out and insults the devs. Paying a few $ doesn't mean a person bought more rights to insult the devs. They are just as much to blame. None of us ware forced to pay. We did it because we wanted an item. 
 

Edited by Firerfly
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9 minutes ago, Firerfly said:

I have heard much more whip lashing from paying players who are unhappy with what is going on with the game.

And when they complain, they'll make sure to tell you how they "spent 100$ into the game, Y U nerf this?"

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Here are the good points....

1 hour ago, Firerfly said:

There we can agree.
 I myself don't play Clan wars no more. Not my cup of tea. I also don't play high PS. And I have seen 'STFU ACE' jerks on both of these as well as with those of 'my kind'. The players who love low PS and do not play clan wars. Bad apples are found in every basket. 
Like you said, one should give respect to deserve it. That is why I am against categorization within the name 'free riders' (though it sounds cool for a faction name). Puts all the apples in the same basket.

None of us are bosses to the devs. Paying or not. If you pay, no one is forcing you to. If you don't pay no one is forcing you to play the game at all. I have heard much more whip lashing from paying players who are unhappy with what is going on with the game. Free players (I used to be one) have just as much right to complain about being unhappy. 
But those who spit curses and death wishes are equally to blame on both sides.
 

@lucashc90

As I have said. It is an option to pay real money for in game goods.  Almost all those in goods are free or unlockable.  I do NOT see there is any entitlement after real money was use to exchanged ingame goods.  The in game goods can be used to play or exchange for other in game goods. For all I know, you can spend real money for a car pack and turn every items to resources, and end up with no coins.   What entitlement can you hold the game company for?  You are free to make to choices before and after a purchase.

Edited by ChopChopChop
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3 hours ago, Firerfly said:

 I myself don't play Clan wars no more.  I also don't play high PS. The players who love low PS and do not play clan wars.

I just have to say that Coven of Belial [COB] accepts low PS, and takes them into Clan Wars, for fun.  Low PS, and Clan Wars aren't mutually exclusive, but you can't be a sore loser.  

Quote

That is why I am against categorization within the name 'free riders' (though it sounds cool for a faction name) Puts all the apples in the same basket.

I wasn't really clear.  I don't have a problem with Free-to-Players.  I have a problem with players that have already been through the grind, (With, or without paying money, regardless of what they claim) belittling the Devs for making a profit on their hard work.  It was a bad term, and implied that free players are scum.  Pretty much the opposite of what I ment.  MM.

 

Edited by psiberzerker
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2 hours ago, Firerfly said:

None of us are bosses to the devs. Paying or not. If you pay, no one is forcing you to. If you don't pay no one is forcing you to play the game at all. I have heard much more whip lashing from paying players who are unhappy with what is going on with the game. Free players (I used to be one for a good while) have just as much right to complain about being unhappy. 
But those who spit curses and death wishes are equally to blame on both sides.

So I will say it's wrong to state that a F2P player is even more worse when he lashes out and insults the devs. Paying a few $ doesn't mean a person bought more rights to insult the devs. They are just as much to blame. None of us ware forced to pay. We did it because we wanted an item. 

I will say it again: me, you and Psiberserker are agreeing on every single topic being discussed here. I don't know if there is some form of miscomunication or language barrier, but it feels like you are trying to prove a point that we both agree. I'm not saying a free player can't vent their frustration, I'm saying that

3 hours ago, lucashc90 said:

 Its already wrong if a paying player do it, being a F2P player and do it even more is worse imo.

there are free players that heve been acting way worse and are way more toxic (I hate that word) than actual "paying customers". As Psiberserker said:

2 hours ago, psiberzerker said:

I have gotten no respect from these very specific players I'm talking about

That is all.

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2 hours ago, ChopChopChop said:

What entitlement can you hold the game company for?

Not entitlement from the game company's end. I'm talking about some player's unending felling of entitlement towards the developers.

Take Bertox for example: he come here, trashes everyone from the games' company, is overall a bad player but claims the game is rigged against him, dishes out every constructive criticism from people that is genuinely trying to help him as "being paid by the devs to speak good about the game" and calls everyone that is slighly better than him (a not difficult feat to be honest) a Clan War Elite, going to the lenght of telling people like me (who doesn't play CW) that "not playing CW doesn't mean you aren't a CW Elite". ALL THAT just to demand from the devs that anything that kills him should be nerfed while the things he uses should be buffed in order to make the game "fair".

Edited by lucashc90
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40 minutes ago, lucashc90 said:

Not entitlement from the game company's end. I'm talking about some player's unending felling of entitlement towards the developers.

Take Bertox for example: he come here, trashes everyone from the games' company, is overall a bad player but claims the game is rigged against him, dishes out every constructive criticism from people that is genuinely trying to help him as "being paid by the devs to speak good about the game" and calls everyone that is slighly better than him (a not difficult feat to be honest) a Clan War Elite, going to the lenght of telling people like me (who doesn't play CW) that "not playing CW doesn't mean you aren't a CW Elite". ALL THAT just to demand from the devs that anything that kills him should be nerfed while the things he uses should be buffed in order to make the game "fair".

Got it, sorry for misunderstanding. :002:

Yeah, over the last 4 years. I have come across number of players does the above. Plus, some of them spend more time on playing this game than an normal average player.

 What can we do apart from putting them on the black list?  They will lose interest once we do NOT respond to their post.  Occasionally, if a topic or post are too out of order we just have to report them that's all.

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18 minutes ago, ChopChopChop said:

Got it, sorry for misunderstanding. :002:

No harm no foul :014:

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On 8/1/2020 at 11:19 PM, Bobbill12345 said:

gaijin has several other games like warthunder and they all follow the greedy live service extreme grind ftp game model

This is what makes your argument valid. If crossout was the only game that was p2w and had plenty of blatant microtransactions, then it might be understandable that the dev team needed a cash cow so they could work more on better games.

But Gaijin’s other games, Warthunder among them, are no different. These games are not cash cows for the devs to work on games that won’t make money, they are cash cows for Gaijin.

P.S. Is Gaijin a public company? I looked it up once, and didn’t find any info of value. Do companies in Europe even have to be public or private?

Edited by Jiffy_boi

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7 hours ago, psiberzerker said:

I wasn't really clear.  I don't have a problem with Free-to-Players.  I have a problem with players that have already been through the grind, (With, or without paying money, regardless of what they claim) belittling the Devs for making a profit on their hard work.  It was a bad term, and implied that free players are scum.  Pretty much the opposite of what I ment.

I work in the gaming industry. A designer, but my work is not on things as big as XO. As such, I support the devs and salute them for making such a unique game. This is a marvel when it comes to pvp games. But I also feel like they DO need to be criticized for the bad moves they do. Still, this criticism needs to be constructive. And if I do like to joke about their bad choices (and oh boy are there a few of them), I am against vulgarity and insults aimed at the devs. 
With that out of the way, yeah, I just wanted to clear the ground that the term you used felt like it was aimed at all the free to play players, at first. But let me tell you, I completely agree with you that those 'get better ace' are the worst, to put it mildly.

5 hours ago, lucashc90 said:

I will say it again: me, you and Psiberserker are agreeing on every single topic being discussed here. I don't know if there is some form of miscomunication or language barrier, but it feels like you are trying to prove a point that we both agree. I'm not saying a free player can't vent their frustration, I'm saying that

there are free players that heve been acting way worse and are way more toxic (I hate that word) than actual "paying customers". As Psiberserker said:

That is all.

Oh don't worry, we do agree and understand each other. I actually red your: 'Its already wrong if a paying player do it, being a F2P player and do it even more is worse imo..' as 'is worse even more'.
I Understood that like paying costumers had more right to lash out.
I'm guilty as charged for the misunderstanding. :) 

Edited by Firerfly
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2 hours ago, Firerfly said:

I support the devs and salute them for making such a unique game. This is a marvel when it comes to pvp games. But I also feel like they DO need to be criticized for the bad moves they do. Still, this criticism needs to be constructive. 

Definitely, +1 to all points.  (Sorry, i can only give you 1.)  

Constructive criticism includes details, they can use.  "Nerf Hovers" isn't detailed enough to use.  They tried that, multiple times, and balance didn't magically fall out, because nobody could agree that the Power Drain (For example) was far too low, and they got inundated with guano suggestions like making them 'splode.  

Some suggestions for possible fixes are just that:  Possible fixes, however.  Such threads inevitably (If not immediately) break down to "My suggestion is bigger, because I have experience, and you're just an Ace, so STFU."  And so forth, by the same players who're just coasting on years worth of grind, so as soon as a new pack hits the market, they can type "CASH GRAB!" then buy it from the stockpile of coins they already have.

Or, buy it from the stockpile of coins they already have, then get on the forum, and tell all the Aces it's a "Cash grab" so nobody buys them.

Flutes?  "Cash Grab."  Not that those are being used to smack down players that don't have them in Missions.  Icebox?  Santa's "Cash grab" when it went on sale, for half price.

It's disingenuous, and for some reason, it always favors the players who already have everything, upgraded, except for the new "Lancer Cabin," which they already denounced, as a "Cash Grab."

Not like they're going to buy it, first thing, and take the Lances off their Hybrid Dog, to pair with the boosters from their Racer, right after they warn the aces not to waste their money on it...

Edited by psiberzerker
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24 minutes ago, Jiffy_boi said:

Like?

50% off on Spectral Hunter or other packs that last had a sale November 2019 or longer

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When was the last time that T-34 pack with the Carapace, and Elephant went on sale?  

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18 hours ago, Doctor_Dentist said:

where do you get this number?

I saw a photo of crossout team somewhere, it was like 10 people xD

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13 hours ago, ChopChopChop said:

I do NOT see there is any entitlement after real money was use to exchanged ingame goods.  The in game goods can be used to play or exchange for other in game goods.

lets say I buy typhoon and spend real money for that because typhoon is the best weapon in the game

Then a week later devs nerf typhoon and make it a useless decor

When I spent real money, I was paying for a powerful weapon not a useless decor

Guess what this is called? a SCAM

And now typhoons price dropped 4k coins, so you cannot exchange it for as much as you spent on it

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18 hours ago, Doctor_Dentist said:

you must also take into consideration platform licensing fees (ps3, ps4, xbox360, xbone, ios, android), steam royalties, publisher's cut to gaijin, server rental, marketing and various overheads

Already counted, use ur scroll wheel

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Most games have either cool or P2W stuff on their shop, Crossout got garbage stuff on the Shop ,looking at the vehicles on the packs , not a single one of them is playable , 2 or 3 look okay.

How are you to incentivize people to buy stuff if all you offer is dissociated from the actual game ?

Every pack vehicle is garbage performance wise ,for new users that don't buy packs based on coin value or want the specific parts/weapons on a pack ,they are less likely to buy any pack because it doesn't show anything cool or interesting.

Cosmetics ,the shop should have much more cheap packs like the woody one , 1 horn + 1 paint with a couple of stickers 1-5€$

Old decor / CK's for sale in the shop individually for 1-2€$ each (not 20$€ for a legendary skin , how much for relic CK then ? 100$€ ?:lol:

They could have epic/legendary cabin CK's on the shop for people that play many months with the same cabin , instead of ck's for blue cabins that are used at the beginning of the game then get left to collect dust (low PS PVE or babysealclubin)

And all gaijin could think to steal some change over 1+year was a 2-part battlepass with both verifier and griffon , a literal "Now you see me , now you don't" , where they got some cash but managed to first make the melee players quit , to now make the hovers players quit , and next the wedge bois are going to quit.

Who will buy the battlepasses after? Adam , Joshua & Co. ?

Edited by h0zz
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11 hours ago, Bobbill12345 said:

lets say I buy typhoon and spend real money for that because typhoon is the best weapon in the game

Then a week later devs nerf typhoon and make it a useless decor

When I spent real money, I was paying for a powerful weapon not a useless decor

Guess what this is called? a SCAM

And now typhoons price dropped 4k coins, so you cannot exchange it for as much as you spent on it

According to you, you’ve spent very little money on the game, and also don’t even play the game anymore. How are you getting so worked up about this?

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19 hours ago, h0zz said:

 

Who will buy the battlepasses after? Adam , Joshua & Co. ?

Anyone have a good market sense or even game sense.

For those whine about the high cost of items....to pay the current basic "battlepass", which I will unlock the last level this week or next depend how much I play XO this few days.

I will gain 1100 coins, 3 X fused "Legendary" cabins which are all around 2200 coins each, totally effectively having 9 "Legendary" cabins.   Some fused weapons and CK kits.  For less than £10.  The amount of time I have saved compare to try to unlock and gain enough resources to craft or exchange the same items? Plus there are extras you can not unlock or buy on the market yet?

The battlepass is the best XO offer if players want to stay to play. Sure, for players plan to play a little and move on, battlepass may not be a good deal. Then again, there won't be any good deals for players wanted to play and move on, are there?

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5 hours ago, ChopChopChop said:

Anyone have a good market sense or even game sense.

For those whine about the high cost of items....to pay the current basic "battlepass", which I will unlock the last level this week or next depend how much I play XO this few days.

I will gain 1100 coins, 3 X fused "Legendary" cabins which are all around 2200 coins each, totally effectively having 9 "Legendary" cabins.   Some fused weapons and CK kits.  For less than £10.  The amount of time I have saved compare to try to unlock and gain enough resources to craft or exchange the same items? Plus there are extras you can not unlock or buy on the market yet?

The battlepass is the best XO offer if players want to stay to play. Sure, for players plan to play a little and move on, battlepass may not be a good deal. Then again, there won't be any good deals for players wanted to play and move on, are there?

What i was implying was that there won't be players on the future to buy battlepasses and there will be only bots running on the servers , sorry for not including subtitles.

But for some reason you think the cashgrab battlepass is a good deal and you need to understand how this game works or even be a good player to buy the battlepass.:5_100_100:

That is why its a cashgrab ... "Here take this 20k virtual coins ,300€$ worth of stuff that you can't really use , and btw we are nerfing griffon when the battlepass is over."

xaxaxa ))))))

And now you have newbs with legendary cabins but no gears or weapons to really put a craft togheter , now they will need to spend more cash on other packs if they don't to wait months to be able to use what they got from the pass.

And pressW people also get a nice fused cabin that is worth alone 100$€ (fusion costs included) that will get nerfed just as the cashgrab annihilator was before, like this is not something new...

Meanwhile a lot of player leave the game because they are not willing to be food for the scrubs that abuse the broken cashgrab stuff early.

And about players just playing a little and move on  , that's because this game atm is garbage for a 2020 game.

Imagine spending money on Crossout if you didn't really had to ... not on this deplorable state  and on the way it's heading.

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Your reasoning is baffling to me.

I never spent any money on the game until the first Battlepass, and I feel I got great value for my money on that. The new battlepass is even better value.

Much better value than packs.

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