it wont matter because they perform better at close range so long as they can keep your weapon in their crosshairs and cannons arent small.
aint gonna matter if it takes you forever and a millennia to reload a single shot. by that time your cannons are sparking or are gone. are you forgetting that arbiters can do alot of damage? the cannons dont have the hp to survive that especially at close range. that boost in damage aint gonna matter one bit if your reload takes you a morning and an afternoon to shoot another shot.
you think people give a crap about that? with all the people i see just rushing head first into you with shotguns and mgs this sentence means nothing. its like the days where people rush into you with porcs and barf porcs all over your face. they arent going to give a single bullet about how much damage you do to them. they just rush in and take off as much off you as they can.
it is when you need to defend yourself.
this is beside the point. yes raids drop additional ammo for you to grab, but who wants to do this for literally every single weapon? who wants to go in and get more ammo for their arbiters or their cyclones when they run low or run out? nobody wants to go fishing for ammo crates to replenish their guns if they can help it. i have to if im running porcs or a ripper because they use ammo.
the ammo count on some weapons is so low you have no choice but to bring ammo packs to raids. the lucifer and the devourer are two examples with stupidly low ammo that should be a crime to release them with such low ammo counts. if you want ammo on them your either running alot or not running them at all.
people do run ammo crates in raids and idk how many dont bring ammo in with them but the ammo count for alot of weapons is to low.
this would just make things more complicated and bothersome. we have a good system as it is now, why fuck that up?
just increase the base ammo of everything, its not that complicated!
Iām not really against quantified ammo, as much as I am āPremium Ammo.ā Iām worried they will begin to sell P2W ordinance, and this provides context for that. Otherwise, I might like this new constraint on ammo.
I donāt want to deal with another overwhelming melee META either.
I probably wonāt, but ya, I bet most people will want to.
Iām curious to know how much ammo they intend to give us. Iām not sure how much is reasonable, and that number will make all the difference, whatever it isā¦weāll see.
They could use this feature to jerk us around a lot, and I wouldnāt be surprised to find the default ammo quantity of various guns be often adjusted with balance updates and patches.
Will they use this feature as a sales opportunity? Will the next Battle Pass have new more-better ammo packs for sale? Will the default amount of ammo a gun carries become the new sales feature and gimmick? IDK.
if the devourer is anything to go by id say around 400. they dont give to much but i hate the fact of requiring to run ammo packs with arbiters or even cyclones. this means sacrificing more armor to put in things we shouldnt need. also inflating our powerscores to. this isnt balanced this is just stupidity.
if they do try the premium ammo crap i am instantly quitting this game for good. when i found out world of tanks did that crap i quit immediately and didnt look back.
then why limit ammo? its only going to make them boulder because they know you have limited ammo and if they can cripple your build by just running into you then theyll do it.
also this will make things like boom sticks and lancelots far more dangerous and meta again. please for the love of all that is the scrap gods above i hope they do NOT do thisā¦
I think the issue that they are trying to solve is that miniguns and cyclones have been the PVP meta for too long, and they wanted to try to rebalance that without resorting to just nerfing their damage and durability.
Cannons didnāt use to have reload modules, and we had to use engines and cabins for reload buffs. When they introduced the reload modules, it was effectively a nerf to all reload weapons, and they have never really recovered from that.
Making overheat weapons use ammo could make them more balanced, and something does need to be done. Clan Confrontation is much too dominated by those two weapon types.
The reload nerf to cannons might be too much, but it looks like the damage is getting buffed more than the reload nerf is taking away, so DPS might not actually get worse.
And as you mentioned in one of your previous posts, reload weapons should do a lot of damage in a single strike. Currently they donāt, so Iām glad theyāre buffing damage on a bunch of them.
We do have several cabins that can buff reload significantly now, and a legendary reload module as well.
Iād like to hear back from someone who can access the test server about how some of the fast reload cannon builds feel after the change, like a hadron/fatman/king combo.
Or is it ārealism?ā Maybe one day theyāll do something about how far fetched cannons on Hovers are.
On paper, I like the limited ammo idea, but I see a hazardous potential for them to abuse the public with this mechanic, and IDK if the developers have the moral restraint to not go there (P2W ammo).
So, youāre ready to crack these eggs and cook that omelette, eh? Me too.
They need to dump the nerf on cannon reload, though (canāt believe there gonna nerf rotation speed again either). Thatās probably the worst part of this proposed update. I donāt use cannons myself, but I know I brutalize them already with drones and passive melee, and this seems like itāll make harassing cannons much easierā¦or they hit me once from across the field (bots?) and end my act before I even get on stage. Neither of those options seem like an improvement or more fun.
Weāll see what makes it to the final cut. Whether this update works or not, looks like to me will rely on the proportions of these proposed changes they ultimately apply; how much ammo we get, how bad they nerf cannon reload, and the damage buff.
How this will effect the strategics in PVP has me wondering. Will people try to hide and wait for everybody to run out of ammo killing bots? Will people ditch guns, and instead go for melee and drones? Will they just give us too much ammo and none of this will even be relevant?
this cabin is the only reliable way to reload cannons and make them usable. reload speed on cannons is to slow nowadays which is why enemies just peel them off like cardboard if your not running a proper reload setup. even then theyll still peel off like cardboard regardless.
id rather have these then fire dogs or anything of that sort. they are taking away hitscan for arbiters and i think thats a significant nerf for them as is. now they have to actually aim and hit their target and not rely on the damage always being at the crosshairs all the time.
dude turning them into classic reapers isnt the answer.
idc about CC much as i dont do it. i get what you mean but theres got to be other solutions then just turning them into a weapon with mechanics we didnt want.
damage increase isnt a buff if the reload gets nerfed.
bring back the 0.5 second reload speed increase when getting a direct hit, then we can talk.
yes they should but the problem is if they increase the reload speed on them then they wont be effective. the issue comes with cannons being huge targets. hell look at the typhoon and the tsunami, they have hit boxes large enough to have their own zip code!
but only one cabin is useful for this, hadron. the other cabins cant hold much weight and are useless for big heavy things like cannons.
cannons on hovers are dumb. seriously when someone fires a cannon on a hover they should be launched into low orbit while the bullet stays right where the car fired it then drop to the ground after a few seconds.
if they do that then i can imagine a ton of the player base will quit. i do not support that type of crap and i never will.
to many possibilities and only one way to find out. the hard way.
imo this is a disaster waiting to happen.
That all depends on the ratio of the changes. If you just buffed damage of cannons while also removing hitscan and adding ammo for DPS weapons, then cannons would possibly end up too strong.
What really matters is how it plays out on the test server.
You might not have wanted this ammo mechanic, and I also wasnāt someone who thought it was needed, but a lot of people have been asking for it for a long time. So we shouldnāt act like it came out of nowhere, just because me and you werenāt pushing it.
Maybe itās unfair for guns to require ammo, while active melee is forever. I donāt think active melee should get a pass on this new mechanic. Their chains and blades should wear out, or they should get a plain durability nerf, or require fuel. Some guy on reddit suggests requiring fuel. I think thatās a great idea, and it would line up well with this update too.
It would make me feel better about the possibility of this game going back to melee hell.
I still think ammo is an indirect nerf to melee. Iāve been playing harvesters again lately, and they already get blown off relatively often from chewing through explosives. If everyone is carrying ammo, thatās going to be even more of an issue.
I think that alone will stop melee from becoming too dominant.
which is locked behind events and a battlepass. make it available to everyone through a permanent blueprint and maybe we can talk. but that aint ever gonna happen so dont get your hopes up.
You seem to have forgotten that ammo packs give percentage boosts. So 400 rounds turns into 840 with a singular (unfused) expanded ammo pack. You get a lot, and you seem to be basing ammo counts off of cannons that donāt give much because they donāt have a high starting number and donāt multiply very well.
My brother in Christ the Hadron is a medium cabin. Both of the cannon cabins are heavy cabs, and have much less PS than the Hadron does, solving your āPS inflation from the 72 ammo boxes I donāt needā problem.
How many times are they going to rebalance this game?
I think the reason for having ammo boxes is lame. āIf two players are left at the end and one has no ammo.ā You get to choose what weapon you want to use. Nobody forces you to run out of ammo. What happens when I run out of wheels?
So far, not much has made me want to turn to helicopters. The missile spam and constant alarm was a big turn-off for me and I basically mothballed that feature soon after it was released.
Please donāt make me play helicoptersā¦I mean, I like them for copper patrols, and I think they are amusing enough for that, but PVP with copters is awful, IMO, and Iām so very glad there are still PVP modes without them.
If they added copters to raids, I might do that, and I think they would be more fun on bigger mapsā¦they still havenāt added them to raids yet, have they? I think they would shine the best in that mode.
Anyway, I donāt think helicopters are a proper solution, as they arenāt even an available solution for many modes.
agreed and this is the reason why i say to give cannons more ammo.
its as obsidianet said, the reason their doing this is because āif two players are left at the end and one has no ammoā so then what? some idiot is crying because he went coo coo for cocopuffs and wasted all his shots on bots then cries about not having enough ammo to defeat the last person alive? when you run cannons or weapons that use ammo thats the risk you take!
but lets say for instance they want a solution to this problem, whats the best way to go? well its simple. increase the ammo count for all weapons that have ammo counts. the ammo cannons have as default is extremely low. they need to heavily rely on explosives to get more ammo where as arbiters and cyclones dont. so why not raise the ammo count?
he even make a good point there to about wheels, if i lose all my wheels and am a sitting duck whats going to happen? am i going to go onto reddit and cry about not having a way to move around cause i lost all my wheels?
that arguement for the reason they want to put that in is stupid.
if they ran out of ammo then thats their problem not ours. they chose to run a cannon or a build that uses ammo so why does everyone have to suffer?
in this new way of doing things what should happen if both players run out of ammo? what, let the timer run down so its a tie and force everyone to wait? chase eachother down and try ramming eachother to death? see who can honk the loudest? maybe admire their wheels or something?
likeā¦ dudeā¦ the answer is simple.
not everyone wants to play these. and if i have to play helis just to avoid melee builds then whats the point?
try saying that to the devourer.
how so?
they said they had plans to add them to a raid they are making specifically for themā¦ sadly the roadmap doesnt look like theyll get to them this year. we dont have them in raids YETā¦ though idk how long itll take them to add that raid inā¦ if they ever do.
