New(ish) player: humpback or bastion?

my current setup is: two armored tracks, two executioners, and apmere generator, a Maxwell radar, jawbreaker cab, and a dun horse. i am working one crafting two (sets?) of ml200’s (when i craft them will it give me one leg or two?). After i get the ml’s i am looking at getting a new cab and i am looking at either bastion or humpback. I do play raid’s (and A LOT of invasion) and since bots shoot at your cab i think the bastion will be nice, however i am only going to be using two executioners so i am try to squeeze as much damage out of them as possible. Also i think the humpback would work better on a levithan. i am planning on getting a KA-2 Flywheel at some point. i have also been looking at trombones so i might need to get a bootstrap gen and a Hot Red engine. i do have a fused hardcore.

My endgame plan is a machinist cab with two mastodons and ml200’s and goliath tracks.

Thank you for any advice on this topic that you can give. :+1:

Fantastic idea, the flywheel is a must have for cannon builds. I would say “how did I survive before I got mine” or something like that… but I really didn’t.

Anyways. The Bastion is nice if you plan on having an exposed cabin but it’s a bit less useful in higher powerscores (doesn’t block energy damage), so I’d recommend a Humpback. It has the highest tonnage of any craftable heavy cabin (I think, been using the Cohort for my heavy builds) and the damage bonus perk is nice for cannons. I’ve noticed that the Humpback performs better overall then the Bastion, but that might be because the Bastion doesn’t really have a perk. Keep in mind the Humpback’s perk stacks well with Equalizer/Arbiter miniguns and Aspects, but it has helped a lot with cannons in the past.

My opinion on your endgame plan:

  • Machinist: Got hella cheap after the minipass, I can see you getting one pretty quickly if you grind a bit.
  • ML200s: Craftable. Pretty easy to obtain, these are assured if you’re dedicated.
  • Goliaths: A bit more on the expensive side (for epic movement), but they’re worth it. Obtainable if you’re dedicated.
  • Mastodons: Uh… how dedicated are you? Mastodons are relics and are way more endgame than you might think, as they require 600 uranium (and a decent clan). Tip for uranium: if you have 600, don’t craft a Mastodon. Sell it, then buy two. Uranium is crazy overpriced, and you can sell it to buy 2x its worth for some reason (at least last time I checked).

It’s a bit to read, but it’s good information.

ML 200s are sometimes very cheap on the market. You might be better off buying them rather than crafting them. And you will eventually want more than four.

Both cabins are decent, and I agree with the comment above about humpback being better in high PS. In lower and mid PS, I think either could be a good choice.

Using cannons in PVE is hard! Lots of small enemies, and they can swarm you while you reload. So if you are making that work, I salute you. I usually go for any DPS weapon for raids.

If I were you, I would prioritize a reload module. Even the special one is good, if you can’t afford a Flywheel yet.

Edit: since you seem most interested in heavy cabins and builds, you may want to consider the other engines. Red Hot is always good to have around because it doesn’t cost energy, but heavy cabins are often best with an engine that boosts your mass limit and power more than top speed (there are some exceptions, but mostly if you are using wheels).
Keep in mind that those mass limit engines don’t boost your tonnage, so you will need lots of movement parts to really take advantage of that mass limit.

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crafting gives 1 leg at a time. usually its cheaper to just buy the legs. but it depends how much coin you have as opposed to resources you can spare.

i play raids and pve alot. i have a much different set up then you but what i can tell you is the humpback, while a decent cabin isnt really that good on its perk. it only increases damage after you take damage, when you stop the damage falls back down. the fact you have to take damage to deal more is kind of bad.
the bastion however is the best, you can tank hits with that plow really good and it cuts all damage in half except energy. so helios, Prometheus, etc. if you can get the perk of reducing all damage by 10% and weight limit so you can add more weight then that would be great. even mass -17% for the cab would be amazing as its pretty heavy to. its a very sturdy cabin and i recommend it.

if your running any kind of reload build the flywheel is mandatory. also if your looking for a boost to that get the hadron cabin, it boosts reload of weapons and can be broken with certain set ups for cannons. it boosts reload based on a few things, what weapons being used and how fast its reload is. itll add the reload times of both weapons up, divide them equally then boost the reload by an additional 15%. my favorite is a fatman fused with reload and a king mine layer with a flywheel. it shoots stupid fast.

machinist is a decent cabin but you need to be careful in building it as it has that lip at the front of the cabin. it is decent though and can hold a ton of weight.
mastodons though are going to take you a loooooooong time to get. relics are end game weapons and unless your constantly in clan wars earning uranium or playing the market then its not worth it. i have a singular mastodon and run it with a mammoth. it works great. id start with mammoths first though if i were you. mastodons are great but relics cost alot.

this 100%. dont use uranium for crafting if you do manage to get some. its not worth it, you get the most out of it by selling it.

ALSO the mini battlepass is out and if you buy it you can get a thor generator. not only will this go way up in price after the mini pass but it gives 4 extra energy and is light weight, but its more explodey then the other generators so be wary of that. its up to you on weather you want it or not but its the best one you can get (minus odin but good luck getting that)

also get some machine guns. tacklers are really cheap and very good to use for a epic machine gun. they have limited angles but they work very well. they are probably the cheapest epic weapon you can ever buy. it never hurts to have back up weapons or just weapons to use.

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@Zarrurer isn’t exaggerating when he says he plays a lot of PVE.
I play very little PVE, so my advice on that is of limited value compared to his.
I was playing a lot of invasion for a few months this year though, if you want any tips on that.
I’m mostly just into PVP and CC.

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Id recommend getting some DPS weapons as well. When one build isnt cutting it, its good to have options. As far as humpback vs bastion with cannons? I think the only choice is the humpback, for PvP anyways. Cannons are lacking in the meta currently. Any extra damage is going to help them immensely. A bastion sounds good on paper, until a machinegun player strips your guns off your build while you still have 75% of your durability.

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Thank you so much for the advice! I do have one problem, i looked on the market and ml200’s are not as cheap as i would like (they are more expensive than executioners, armored tracks, omnis, atoms, and a lot of other craftable epics). i have already acquired some of the materials for ml200’s, so i am going to look into pricing and figure out what would be best.

executioners kinda work in pve if you can aim for explosives, but i do think i will get some consistent damage weapons. (i was looking at gl-55’s until the devs ruined them)

i do like the idea of a fused bastion but i will have to commit.

i played all the way up to 7.7 on the german tech tree in Warthunder (and only learning to not be terrible at the game at 6.7) so i know how to commit

tacklers are VERY cheap so i probably will get one (thank you especially for that tip)

i do not want to put money into this game to much because of what the devs are doing (might do it if they stop killing the game)

i want to stick with heavy cabs so i probably will not get the hadron until after i have gotten machinist but i really do like the perk

this is what i have to say for now.

thank you again to everyone that has commented

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i am going to get a Ka-1 dicharger

bastion has 9000 tonnage humpback has 8000

liking bastion in pve but pvp is problem

humpback looks good on levithan and in pvp

to protect my cannons is i armor the sides of them and when i am reloading i just turn sideways and let them hit my armor (but this would make bastion pointless)

still thinking but you guys are making excellent points

Everyone approaches the game differently, but I’ve really enjoyed just expanding my inventory, rather than chasing any particular long term goal.

I wouldn’t worry too much about which one to get, but rather which one to get first. They both have uses, and having options really increases my enjoyment of building and playing.
I have a humpback, but this thread is making me miss my old bastion builds, so there’s a good chance I’ll make that my goal for next week.

Semi-related, I recommend dabbling in lots of playstyles, even if you have a favourite. Pick the type of build that gives you the most trouble when you’re running your executioners, and make your own version of your nemesis. Play a bunch of battles with that build, and you’ll see what works against it.

Tonnage don’t matter if you’re using tracks. Humpback is lighter, meaning you can fit more on your vehicle. Humpback, in my opinion.

the problem with ml-200s are
1: they are slow. the move at a max of 50km/h.
2: any slight hill or incline drops their speed drastically. it might not look like it but i mentioned this before. even when all 6 of my ml-200s were touching the ground they still has a drastic speed reduction and it made it very difficult to go anywhere fast. itll say your travelling at 50 km/h but thats a lie when it comes to a slight hill or incline. if you use them youll see what i mean. the exhibition has builds with legs as welland if you have a garage with hills you can try it out there. if you can customize your garage put some slopes and stuff in there and try out the legs. youll get what i mean.

heres a few weapons i can recommend from my experiences. some are expensive but very good. ill go from epics to legendary to give you a good idea.

1: Tacklers. i already explained these but they are cheap, really good and wont break your bank. VERY good on the Icebox cabin. cheap to fuse as well, wait for an event to come and fuse a bunch together (events let you use 2 tacklers to fuse instead of 3). also more then 1 is recommended.

2: Incinerator / Jotun. if you like fire puddles or cryo puddles then these are good weapons. incinerators do more damage but are more difficult to use. Jotun is a cryo mortar that functions similarly to the incinerator but has a few more effects. these two cancel eachothers effects out so dont use them together.

3: Caucasus. this is a lock on and auto fire gun. they are quite big though but basically you aim at an enemy, hold the trigger for a few seconds and it auto locks and starts firing. it is a bit wonky at times though, itll lose enemies when people drive in front of you, they go over a hill, etc. i only ever use these in raids or events.

4: gravastar. if you get fire rate on these for the fusion then omg the rate at which these things fire is ridiculous. being a shotgun they are frail but they can do a ton of damage and can also be very useful in raids / events.

5: Thresher. a discount retcher. not bad and they fire pretty quick.

6: fat man. if you get one for reload speed, slap it on a hadron with a king mine layer and a flywheel LOL dude youll be firing rounds so fast youll run out of ammo in no time. its a good weapon though and durable. its a precision cannon though so it doesnt have a huge hit box like the mastodon.

7: Nagual. i used 3 of these on a hadron with a reload booster and sweet arceus above the precision damage on these things is DISGUSTING! you only get 3 shots before you have to reload and burst firing isnt recommended, but if you can get 3 shots to land itll pop a cyclone clean off someone. fuse them and the damage gets more hilarious.

8: AC64 Joule. its an auto cannon and its really good! 3 of these is enough for you. or 2 with a cyclone. these things can do alot of damage, the downside is their cost and the spread but they have great damage and are useful in events and raids.

9: elephant. the elephant is like the fatman but its more precise and has longer range. its a good cannon but doesnt have the reload perk the fatman does. its still good but its price is a bit high.

10: Phoenix. the phoenix crossbow is good but there are downsides. its HUGE. like, quite big. its projectile sticks to enemies and can be shot off. but if you manage to get off that damage oh man… the explosion from the projectile is where all of the damage is, try aiming for enemies wheels or their explosives/vulnerable spots. if you can master it, its a really good weapon but i only recommend it for pve.

11: gungnir. its not BAD its ok, useful in pve only really.

12: Fafnir. one of my favorite shotguns. being a shotgun though it suffers from lack of range and needing to be very close to deal alot of damage. but if you can look past that this thing shreads anything it gets close to. not to useful in pvp, it can be used in pvp but pve is nice to if you dont mind getting up in someones grill.


1: Cyclone. this is the mightiest autocannon youll ever find in the game. this thing shreads builds and does ALOT of damage. get two of these and youll rip apart builds. only downside is they are huge. the upside is they fire faster the longer the trigger is held down. very VERY good in pve.

2: Retcher. you ever want to watch your enemies suffer? get this gun. the retcher is like the thresher and the gl-55 but on steroids. this fires 4 grenades per burst and does STUPID amounts of damage. it does explosive damage so them explosives on enemies arent safe at all. the only downside is they are frail but the damage they put out is incredible. test them out if you want to see. i highly recommend these in raids or pve.

3: Helios. these not only deal raw energy damage but if you hit a full burst on an enemy itll deal damage directly to their cabin as well. all you got to do is hold down the button and aim.

4: Arbiters. my favorite minigun. 3 energy, can have 4 of them on your car with coolers and radiators they are great. highly recommended if you are looking for a good minigun. they are like the equalizer but they have a better damage bonus. being a minigun though they are frail but good in pve.

5: Reapers. these miniguns are like the arbiters but ate to many muscle milk factories. these fire nonstop and never overheat. the only downside though is they require ammo though ammo packs or expanded ammo packs. they have a newer perk that fires a armor piercing round every 10th shot if you connect 10 shots. really good guns if you want them.

6: fortunes. as a mine layer they are REALLY good. they fire very hard and fast. they fire 3 shots per ammo and do alot of damage. put these on a hadron with flywheel and fused for reload and projectile speed and you basically got a nuke. these do alot of damage but are frail. still they are nice to have but now suffer harshly in pve due to the nerf they got where your shots can explode on allies to. a good weapon but hampered by the nerf.

7: Aspect. frail but quite a tiny gun. they are very good but their perk could use a little more work. still good for stripping weapons though.

8: Avalanche. this is a hit or miss for alot of people. on the upside this thing hits like a truck. the downside is it has a harsh reload and it uses 12 energy. but if you like things that go boom then try it. if you can somehow combine it with the hadron, flywheel and a king then its fantastic and that reload speed is cut drastically. but they changed the weight so its super heavy now. 5333 kg.

9: toadfish. its a crossbow that fires 2 rounds. if the first round connects the second one has increased impulse. its an ok weapon but they are giant.

10: athena. i havent used one of these but i herd it makes people angry cause its powerful. i dont recommend it though but if its your playstyle try it out.

11: mammoth. these are the lower version of the mastodon. they still hit like a full force tuna slap to the face and can be used in pvp and pve but in pve people tend to use faster firing weapons so maybe not. still great to use though!

12: nidhogg. the upgraded version of the fafnir. you want to shread someone like a blender? look no further then these shotguns. you have to basically be hugging the enemy but man these things just rip people apart. only downside is they are frail. not really useful in raids but you can use them if you want.

13: mandrake. a very tricky weapon to use. id recommend using them in your garage to see if you like them. these are a mortar cannon that fires 5 shots. if they land HOO BOY THAT DAMAGE. theyll be feeling that for the next week! the major downside is the energy cost (7) and the fact they are a ranged weapon. anyone sees you running these and youll be eye candy to them. easy to spot and easy to take out. but if you can land them hits omg. lol. (theres another like the mandrake which is the heather, i do NOT recommend this because its quite bad. you have to land the shot directly on the enemy to deal damage, if they even move an inch itll miss and it has no AOE where the mandrake has a large AOE and its fire puddles to massive damage)

14: starfall. its an anti air gun but it can be useful in pve as well. even if its shots miss they can explode in mid air and still do damage so long as they are near the enemy.

15: Dove. i guess if you want this its an option. its a mine layer and does quite alot of damage. its not a bad weapon at all.

a few cabins i can recommend as well is

hadron: for the reload.
cohort: because it can boost defense and it can support alot of weight.
nova: the shield is useful for absorbing damage but you gotta build around it.
favorite: for miniguns or guns that overheat. helps to stop the overheating for a few seconds.
icebox: increases damage of limited turning weapons (like tacklers).
harpy: increased explosion radius, increased ammo from ammo packs, microfactories to.
bastion: for the damage resistance and tankyness.
howl: increases your damage as there are enemies around you within a certain radius.
echo: optional but charges when enemies are near, when activated it speeds up reload for weapons that use ammo for 7 seconds.
omnibox: has 2 modes, 1 increases reload speed and cooling, 2 increases cabin speed and power.

and thats pretty much it. sorry for the wall of text xD

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The heather is surprisingly good for PvE. Cannon bots stay in one spot the whole match, and they can deal ABSURD damage. I’ve gotten 2k out of ONE. Combine 2 with a finwhale and fused flywheel (and a “shoot 'n scoot” playstyle, their perk reloads faster while moving faster) and you have a rapid-fire artillery that does crazy damage. They do require practice though.


oh i forgot to mention that. yeah they are good for pve. if you can land a shot from a heather on a bot HOOOOOO BOY thatll hurt lol. they do require practice though and are a trick weapon to use.

yeah so have i. in one volley i got over 2k damage and they were looking like they went on a major diet after it hit LOL!

i was wondering what the finwhale was, i thought it was the cabin and i had to look, i forgot that was the engines name and not the cabin. they have similar names so i got them confused. but yeah that could work. though aiming them while moving does require some practice.
7 energy per heather… finwhale is 15 and… cloak im guessing?

No, flywheel. A hadron cabin would be nice too.

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discharger then flywheel

discharger cheap flywheel is not

i do like the incinerator, Caucasus, mammoth, reaper, mandrake, heather and a few other you listed
i probably will do tacklers for now and then get some of those (tacklers are CHEAP)

and i am liking the bastion so far

also ml’s are slow but they have lots of durability and camera locking capabilities (i think in the future when i have more coin i will get some bigrams)

but for now i am doing a heavy build and need durable movement part that can camera lock.

although i will keep their slowness when going uphill in mind

two things

  1. i am currently using tracks but i am planning to get legs before i get a new cab

2.though the humpback is light it has less tonnage therefor meaning it will need more movement parts to get its tonnage up to its mass limit and each movement part decreases acceleration and cost weight.

i tested ml’s and they did not have any problems with hills (didn’t like turns though)

With strafing parts, it’s really about how you combine pivoting and strafing. Driving them like a car or tank doesn’t really work well.
Have you considered meat grinders?