I know we have had multiple thread on it over the years.
And I realize people don’t want bot so smart that they whoop everyone, but they also don’t want bots so dumb that they just sit there.
On one hand you will have a dumb bot at FULL health, with all their guns, ignore targets right in front of them.
Then on the other hand I’ll spawn into a match and have 3 bots lock on to me and chase you like a mad man till your dead. (I understand you can break this lock with stealth and other methods, but that’s not the point of this thread.)
So we know bots can be dumb and super smart at the same time. Instead of that why don’t they make all the bots medium? I don’t want dumb bots on my team, but I also don’t want bots that never miss.
This is kind of a spin off of the below linked topic. I wouldn’t mind if the bots on each team were the same. But they need to be the smarter too.
I prefer if bots were removed and PS brackets were opened up a bit in MM with the undertiered players getting rewarded for the hassle. Also there could be a mechanic where lower PS builds have translucent map icons so we are more discreet when making plays.
If it’s true that some bots are purposefully made smart or dumb, it could have something to do with the 50/50 matchmaker. Such as teaming up someone after a series of losses with smarter bots, in order to increase their chances of winning, and thus spending money on the game. And on the other hand, if someone’s winning streak is too long, perhaps they get dumber bots, so that losing players don’t get discouraged too much. Maybe Gaijing doesn’t want all bots to be medium-smart, if everyone winning and losing approximately 50% of the time results in more revenue (which would be a clue as to how little they think of the playerbase). But what do I know, the ‘50/50 matchmaker’ conspiracy theory has been debunked on this very forum, despite having been confirmed by some of the top players, including youtubers and Twitch streamers. I have no idea, so I’m just repeating what those elite players have said. Does it make me look like a smart bot, repeating their conspiracy theories?
From what I’ve observed, bot behaviour is greatly influenced by radar coverage. If I (or a teammate) is running a Doppler, the bots get a lot more aggressive, but if they can’t see enemies on the minimap, they revert to capturing the cap.
I seriously doubt that the matchmaker is anywhere near as complex as some of you seem to believe.
My theory is that most matchmaking weirdness is just due to low player numbers in that PS range, and of course the huge advantage that a well coordinated group has over a bunch of randoms (or a more casual group).
One irrefutable observation Ìm sure youve all seen as well is a bot deciding to engage only when nearing death. The quintessential one that stands out is the top PS Firebug Humpback Spark bot. It will sit as the last enemy alive, within range to shoot the entire time. Get it close to dead and you can watch it come to life and immediately do what it shouldve done all along: shoot an enemy in range. Another common bot that will do the same thing is the Breaker Torero bot. Within range for 10+ seconds, idly sitting in the cap, only to start firing once it is close to dead/stripped.
The above alone shows there is an algorithm affecting how hard the bot tries.
As monkey said, there will also be times where 3 bots go full suicide squad to get to you, ignoring all other players while simultaneously going full DPS, never missing.
Its hard to put it down to a science where you can know what the bots will do before they do it, but i do suspect there is some truth to the 50/50 matchmaker theory. But there may be decieving outlying reasons they do what they do. They definitely will targrt the first thing they see at times, which could make you feel as though theyre coming to kill you specifically, when in reality you simply drove your fast build towards them while your team did not.
I don’t think it’s as geared to manipulate win rates as much as it is a mechanism to discourage people from over-farming resources. JMO. I do think the matchmaker is leaning on the scales for one reason or the other, and killer bots is one of the methods it uses to rig matches, and it’s hard to believe more people haven’t noticed. Players do the same thing though; spot targets, single out, and harass particular players.
It’s not just that some bots are dumb and others aren’t though. It’s part of the PVP matchmaker hustle, and I think it’s designed to keep resource farmers down, rather than encourage any particular win-rate. That, I think, has been debunked by players showing off amazing loosing streaks that demonstrate if there was a push to make a 50/50 win/loose ratio the matchmaker could certainly arrange that better, I think.
I nudged one that appeared to be off alone sleeping (dormant), and then it suddenly woke up and fired. IDK what it’s trip was. It was weird though. I try to peel bots off walls and stuff, and encourage them along if I can.
I used to like having a hover balloon on the end of my Skinner. The Hovers would always rush in and get pwnd, but if I could capture one they made for good auxiliary weapons, and good meat shields as well.
The thing is, I’ve also seen those two bots get MVP sometimes. Again, I think it’s a radar issue, combined with however the bots decide to switch targets.
Pretty sure neither of them have any radar, so if they’re not getting map info from players, they just focus on getting to the cap. The visual radius isn’t very big, so enemies can be pretty close to them and still be essentially invisible to the bot.
The bots also don’t seem to be able to switch targets very easily, so if multiple enemies are firing on them, they can seem a bit paralyzed.
If you want to test my theory, make a build with a Doppler, Keen, and radio (or swap in a maxwell/listener if you’re playing low PS). The bots should behave a lot more aggressively. Even better if a few allies are running dopplers for maximum coverage.
At the very least, run a radio so that more of the bots see what you see.
I would like to add something that i keep on mind
The quality of matchmaking / player filler is very poor, instead of making competitive situations, it generates autowin / autoloose scenarios that makes battles to prolong less than 2 minutes.
You can see several examples of this behaviour below that demonstrates dramatical difference between scores and allows to do next conclussions:
“PvP” is AI controlled. It’s goal to ‘mix’ everything to 50 / 50 .
Your efforts means nothing, it is pointless to do anything, system will detect you jumping above its “desire” and punish you by forcing you to loose more games fighting against higher-skilled enemies (bots)
Those higher-skilled enemies (bots) 's parametres (aim, focus, reaction, etc) is bigger than human can do. While human looking at the screen, trying to find best aim, the machine is already shooting off player’s weapons.
Those situations are similar to when human is forced to fight against predator he is uncapable to defeat (bear tiger etc) without having advantage (trap gun etc) that can have serious negative mental influence
Sequential looses with no-solution (means you were forced to loose and someone’s / something’s else controled that situation) can have serious negative mental influence.
Let’s just add that game is rated as ESRB (13+) and PEGI (7+).
So, the kid plays against the machine that outscales him/her at everything and forcing him to loose, destroying him over and over again, until it won’t say : " okay now you can win few rounds to get your 50% W, meatskin "
In my opinion, there are no smart bots, only dumb ones.
However, some builds are quite dangerous if you don’t react accordingly or avoid them strategically.
For example, spider typhoon builds are not to be underestimated if you also use a build with ranged armament, because they aim very accurately and can do a lot of damage if you use lighter faster builds. You must not stop in this case, but also not accelerate in a linear way, because the bots are very accurate in calculating the trajectory for the next shots. Timing is everything in this case - stopping, not accelerating linearly, stopping, etc. - assuming you have some distance. You should also be able to use cover like houses or, even better, uneven terrain - otherwise you’ll take a lot of damage. The same goes for Mastodon builds - although these are not as dangerous as Typhoon or Tsunami builds, but much more difficult to crack, as they can take a lot of damage. The time needed to crack them is often too high or too disadvantageous, because in the meantime reinforcements are coming or the situation on the battlefield has changed.
The most dangerous bots in my opinion are the hover retcher builds when they surprise you. If you don’t act immediately and eliminate the retchers, they can do a lot of damage to your team. Most of the time, they come into your team like drunkards and shoot around like crazy. But I wouldn’t call these bots smart ;D