There is NO complexity to Crossout’s PvP! (Compared to most PvP games, it’s even slow for a shooter)
Just a bit of team play and a little practice in using the few tricks quickly learned.
Anyone who will boast they are a great player at this game is just a playground kid shouting out to the other kids he can swing higher.
You at least make good looking non-meta builds and obviously have fun. That’s worth more to you than someone who can swing higher at the playground while his mom keeps pushing him (I’m not aiming at anyone here).
If it actually does anything, it should show up in every game. I doubt I would have to play 20 games to see matches where it clearly had no impact.
How exactly do you think it works?
Again, how exactly do you think x999 PS builds change how the matchmaker works?
Either they lock you into a PS range or they don’t. If they don’t, you would see exceptions to the rule emerging immediately.
What? You… just, are going to punish progression then? I do not understand, fusions are a luxury you can afford for when you want to settle down and use a particular module, cabs, and maybe movement parts. With guns… Not really being fused due to the fact that they can only be used typically with themselves and anything over special requires you to be keen on using them often to justify their investment. If anything, fusions are a luxury reward for finding your favorite place in game. Or using your favorite modules and movement parts, however, they are NOT by any means the big game decider, as much as people like to recoil at the sight of 5% damage and 9% reload speed, most of the time, it’s only going to give you a free shot every 5+ you do or offer you an extra 100 damage for pinning the fire on someone for 8 entire seconds. Ergo, I do not consider fused items in need of any form of nerf. The perks they give are not strong enough even in groups to warrant a PS increase, as that would just make the weapons effectively worse.
Now the co-drivers, anyone looking from the outside, in, could go “oh I see, fusions need a PS increase” and I’d go “it’s a bit misguided but ok.” But… Co-drivers? Really? How are co-drivers unfair and in need of a PS increase? Not every weapon has their own dedicated co driver, but now everyone CAN use one and still be better off than the current system. It still makes absolutely no sense to tarnish co-drivers with the folly of trying to inflate their PS. You cannot unequip co-drivers, you aren’t supposed to, the devs spent time working on this whole damn system just so that people can say “but they shouldn’t matter”? “But the unfair advantage!” People may cry, “but they give them damage and I don’t” they say. As someone who has never had the capacity to full rank most of my co-drivers due to my interesting subclass, I just say deal with it, and grind harder. You are given 30 entire levels, that is more than enough to start respectably making a dent in the co-driver tech trees, I had to grind Jade to level 15 with a subclass that earned sub 2k reputation on her co-drivers, and everyone is telling me they cannot, with weapons. Be bothered or even capable of grinding to a respectable co-driver level? Does everyone just play patrol and get sub 300 points or something?
At any rate, I don’t agree with outright nuking a good majority of people’s builds who have fused items because they found the playstyle they liked and felt secure enough in their playstyle and didn’t feel swayed to other playstyles enough to fuse their equipment to be better at what they do. Even if it isn’t much, only for them to suddenly gain God knows how much PS people want to throw at them so that their vehicle might as well be worse than an unfused one. Must everyone be so sensitive on this forum?
Again, I am not suggesting a massive increase!
Just enough that veteran players can’t clobber people in low PS who mostly haven’t levelled up their co-drivers or fused their items.
Also, you can’t have it both ways: either fusing items is worth the high cost because it does give you a big advantage, or it doesn’t.
You did not listen to what I said, I bluntly stated it’s an investment, as a way of progressing once you’ve decided your favorite equipment, it’s a luxury, I don’t need 2 fused mandrakes to destroy you or be good and destroy another player, but if I like mandrakes, I have the coin, I have the resources, I don’t feel like I’m going to regret my decision, (this is ultra-important for guns since they’re typically center focused in balance patches and a gun can be nerfed or buffed) and I am not interested on exploring other guns. I might opt to fuse them for ideal fuses to gain a small amount of effectiveness. This isn’t enough to “clobber” people, and on top of this, for co-drivers, you are not understanding that you have a solid 30 levels of safe haven to grind your way, also note, because the levels are set xp based, the amount of time it takes for you to get OUT of below engineer faction 30 SHOULD be enough to have you attain a decent amount of co-driver skills. It is honestly not hard to grind, even as a new player.
Plus, why do so many people, instead of saying "huh, does the 5% damage cause me to lose? Or the fact the player has been playing for 3 years. seriously, if I were most of these people, I’d be requesting more safe zones for new players instead of somehow trying to invalidate other people’s progression and nerf them to the point a newbie can safely take them on? Why would you even tackle co-drivers, something a newbie can attain with enough grinding. Even as a newbie, it incentivizes the skillful increase of the player, and incentivizes them to do good. Progression why are you trying to make that very thing a worse scenario for everyone. The newbie cannot use them unless it gets clobbered by vets who do use it, and those vets that don’t use it… Will just clobber the new player anyways?
Plus, nobody has a clear system of what this SHOULD be, how much for each passive you unlock, how much for each fused item, are you SURE that a fully fused decked out vehicle won’t have so much PS as to make it already hopelessly outclassed? If so, that’s incredibly foul, will it be so low as to BARELY matter? Remember, matchmaking cares in the THOUSANDS, not the hundreds, so, assuming newbie here at 3k with his lil car, exists at prestige, co-driver is leveled up halfway because he’s worked pretty hard… Now… that entire stretch of PS he’s going to see is from 2-4k. Approximately, more or less depending on the time of day and whatnot, but that’s beside the point, veteran is at 3k. Now, there’s not a lot of parts on a 3k car that can be fused at most we’re talking a couple of wheels, 3ish guns, a cab, and maybe a module or two.
Now, you see the BIG problem here? Your system of raising the values of fused parts PRIMARILY will affect the people at higher powerscores, the ones with the most fused stuff, the one with all the trinkets tacked on. ANY model you make that is an increase depending on the fused parts will not matter, if anything, only very minor PS gain will be on the end of the vets at the lower end of the PS spectrum, especially the proposals, so far, again, they only would affect middle and higher tier PS. So far, nobody has brought a proposal that convinces me nor anyone that actually thinks with care for the game’s survival especially at the medium and high powerscores (where most players reside) that this should actually be a valid and considered option.
Like I said earlier, why are you even going after fusions and co-drivers, they don’t matter to a newbie V veteran, everyone seems to think if we just make it a 1 v 1 same vehicle somehow the newbie would triumph, no, they’d STILL lose almost every time. So, blaming the -17% spread imps for kicking your face in and the co-driver perk that may not even have kicked in until after you died… Instead of saying the person was just… a veteran at the video game? Not going to turn this into a big “skill issue” argument, but if you TRULY wanted newbies to be safe, with the increasing player numbers, and the returning veterans, and crossplay coming, don’t you think that maybe that time would better be spent idk… Advocating for… Better tutorials? Longer or more informal safety levels. (engineer faction levels 1-30 are a safe haven you cannot match against prestige levels) Anything instead of trying to Directly attack, invalidate, and even consider destroying the inventories of other players?
“Reeeee I don’t like this suggestion bcuz it’s going to nerf my X999 build and I will have to use my only brain cell to make something new and viable, therefore it’s UNACCEPTABLE REEEEE.”
Clearly, this addresses all the points of contention I had surrounding the idea that isn’t really an idea because it actually still has no model nor idea on what it should exactly besides speculation and that’s why the devs will not pay 1 single glance to it.
Go back to your X999 build from exhibition, kiddo. Clearly you do not pay attention to the topic, you just plain don’t like it due to the reason I stated in my previous message.
Now, for some who can actually understand anything besides “muh only build and endless grind with no goal” I can elaborate.
Let’s pick two builds: a 7999 PS and a 8300 PS. With co-drivers bonus PS’ll increase to 8099 and 8400, respectively. A good old casual player will keep their 8400 and won’t care. A PvP addict will become salty about it.
Let’s say those builds were reduced back to 7999 and 8300 PS WITH co-drivers bonuses. First one, since it’s a PvP addict, has had all their items fused (about 6500 PS). Second one has had a half of their items fused (about 5000 PS). Adding 5% PS for fused items and we’re getting 8324 PS for the first build and 8550 PS for the second build.
In both cases there is no significant PS increase except for PvP X999 addicts. I can only have pity on them, similar to watching a hamster in a wheel thinking it’s the only way its life should be. In both cases only X999 players will suffer because they will succ hard when they get matched with PS slighly higher than on their X999 range.
Thus, Poony made a good suggection which may be implemented if devs see something in it. In such case I will finally get some salt for my
Or, if you actually payed attention to the original subject of the forum, it was never about destroying the “X999” builds you’re so angry against, why are you so pissy against people who don’t want to enter a whole new bracket to face enemies. On top of this, none of my builds get that close to the border of their PS brackets. So not only are you making assumptions of me, but not responding at all to what I was saying nor what was the “suggestion’s” original intended target was. Which wasn’t X999. It was low PS prestige players. But let’s take a look at your points.
This is already invalid because this is not the powerscore they choose, and you also in fact, just proved, why this entire idea is invalid, it’s only a 400-500 PS increase, if a newbie was at 7k, they’d face approx, 7 and 8ks, they’d still have a chance to face that fused player. You are inserting your own ideas into this whole suggestion.
Even better, you can still fight the enemy
There it is. Poony’s MAJOR flaw in his idea comes from the fact that he can’t have the PS increase be a subtle thing AND work. The matchmaker deals in thousands, not hundreds, I can make a great all fused build at 3,300, get fusion and co-driver penalties to 3900, and still kick the newbie’s face in.
I honestly have zero idea what you’re rambling on about, I don’t get your rage against triple 9s, I find it a bit sad, but, you do you? Anyways, I made my point because I saw what he wanted, and what he wanted wouldn’t work without more extreme action, actions he does not know yet, if he can design a system, then maybe most will accept it.
Ha! The devs all but abandoned the forums long ago, on top of this. They don’t look at incomplete barebones ideas with nothing but words that can be ripped to shreds, you cannot submit an idea to the devs with just “please mr dev add this”. Sorry, it just doesn’t work that way.
you’d notice that I don’t value your opinion. Therefore, you shouldn’t be huffing and puffing trying to prove that your fuzed X999 build should never be changed not because you’ll lose your only advantage that keeps you from being steamrolled but because “it’s all in the skill but fuze doesn’t matter don’t touch fuze you have no idea reeee”.
Because you already proven that you are salty because what Poony suggests is going to nerf X999 fuzed builds only. I heard all I need about “muh fuzed inventory”.
this right here is the core problem for the naysayers. its a contradiction based on a falsehood.
fusions do matter and they make a noticeable improvement, even on small vehicles, think 4 fused hovers, fused engine, fused cab.
the cabin fusions are insanely op at max ps. the -mass +mass limit, tonnage and power fusions.
weapon fusions for dura can mean it cant get oneshot by some weapons. they can be pretty strong too.
its all extremely evident in cw, only a fool would argue fusions dont play a role there. in pvp and also lower ps pvp its the same thing, maybe less noticeable. youre still going to use an engine, movement parts, a cab and weapons. and yes, you have an advantage if all of those are fused.
and thats the argument of the yaysayers, fusion gives and advantage therefore it should be balanced with slightly higher ps.
but when support vehicle talks about progression it sounds to me like he thinks he should be able to play with an advantage because grind/cc which is not what i would call progression at all.
Then… If fusions do so much to help you and make so much difference, then, why is the request not another balance but to make it slightly higher PS, of which, you still, have no valid model that does what he asks.
Nice assumption, but few of my items are fused besides a select few modules, but unlike most people here, I’m using logic to attest that your points are more or less… just not really a good thing.
NOT what Poony’s idea is stating
OP at max PS? What? Mass mass cabin fusions aren’t that op, tonnage cabins are only for very select builds, and power fusion is the only thing you’d actually have a valid point… if it were for the fact that typically it wouldn’t matter much anyway unless you were being pushed or having to shoot someone trying to accelerate.
Many of this has been proposed to be fixed and many of this is because of the simple fact that scorpions exist, a singular weapon that can deny a weapon’s existence if two can one shot it. Take away scorps, and their entire shtick (10% incoming damage nerf to scorps is coming) and you have a bit of breather room for all guns.
Fusions really shine in CW because it’s the only way to improve besides just better build V better build, along with that, fused weapons are not required by ALL clans, in fact, I’ve rarely seen a clan require an all fused loadout, maybe they require a fused apollo… but that’s it, and mass fuses and power fuses are the only ones I’d actually consider to make pretty noticeable combat differences and for that you need a LOT of your stuff fused.
This “yessayer” is not only
completely missing the point
and 2. makes assumptions
So let’s see where you ACTUALLY, went wrong: Poony’s entire thing, is about “balancing” fusions AND co-drivers, by increasing their powerscore, at low ps… something you cannot do without screwing over the high PS builds, and NOBODY still has an idea on how to do that it seems. Everyone screams at me “IDEA ISN’T BAD YOU ARE!” without actually, saying anything valid to the point. Nor is anyone actually getting the points I laid down nor addressing the concerns I had; how convenient.
You want to slightly raise PS? Congrats, matchmaker deals in thousands, not hundreds, you did nothing besides be an annoyance. You want to more than slightly raise PS, congrats, you made a good few all fused builds useless.
You can’t do this and save new players, so why is anyone coming after fusions in the first place, the luxury system that needs a LOT of coin dumped into it to eventually hopefully get an alright boost in performance if at all. My playstyle barely changed after I fused some items. There’s only a select few that are strong on their own, those being apollo mass, and cooler/rad eff, and -mass on heavier items like doppler or flywheel. Even then, that’s only a few extra light parts at most, even with taking that in. The reason -mass apollo is pretty strong of a fuse on it’s own is because apollo’s sheer weight makes it so that you can finally attain 196 extra mass. That is… barely 80 hp.
Extra damage is just a simple added value, however, the reason everyone freaks when it’s given to scorp is because when that extra damage is given to scorp the lengths it can decide what other weapons get to live for making one mistake is even tighter. Yet, it is getting nerfed, explosion radius is not that big of a fusion so, and then you have reload speed, it’s just below the discharger module, you know, the one that nobody really uses because 10% really isn’t enough to make a huge difference and having it be 9% doesn’t help. You have projectile speed which is alright on some weapons, but it won’t be a dynamic game changer and requires an extra learning curve especially if you have played with a weapon for long periods of time. You got -spread for some MGs which hopefully would let the 1 of every 10th shot that WOULD’VE missed actually hit. Then you have cooling power which simply lets you reset ever so slightly faster to start firing again. Then you have extra range… on… machine guns…
You can see the issue; fusions alone never decided any battle. Never said they’re not worth it. Never said they’re completely useless. You too can fuse a growl cabin for literally a few 60ish coin. Specials for around 300ish. In the ACTUAL reason this change was proposed, why did people go after the random fusion an co-driver function, instead of just… saying Veterans kill you, how can this be avoided, instead of collectively sobbing and acting like you’ve just formed a new religion. Guess what? If you make fused items gain a modicum of PS, you’d STILL get trashed by them, NOTHING will change, if your goal was to balance CW, nothing you just said would even matter, if your goal was to balance matchmaking, show me a PS increase scale that is consistent, screws no builds over, and actually warrants that level of increase. Never have I EVER, played my weapon catalogue, which most of it is unfused, and if fused it’s only one or two low tiers and thought to myself “damn… clearly it was the fusions and the co-driver perks that got me”. I fail to understand how so many can get their mindset so warped that what went from raging yourself into finding tutorials on how to get better to crying on the forums about how the 17% lighter doppler hurt you
Alright, so it appears that you concede, alright, Thanks.
But since you have such a tantrum and attitude akin to a toddler when you see them… I figured you’d get a kick out of yourself a few years down the line when you realize just how depressing of a display this is. Proven to lack any form of ability to hold their own in an argument. Have a good day.
For new players , under 4K, the matchmaker does actually deal in hundreds, not thousands. Typically a match under 4K is made where all players are within about 500 points in power-score. Pitting a player running a build at 4K with a player at 5K is a slaughter at those power-scores, while a player running a build at 9K facing a player running a build at 10K is a much closer ratio than the former. One is a 10% difference and the other is 25%.
If an attached penalty for a full fusion build amounted to just 500 points in power-score, this would be enough keep the Aces from getting trolled, while not even being a noticeable difference to veterans playing at 9K and up.
Or one could remove fusing for rare items and prohibit epics/legendary/relics at very low PS (no epics below ~4k, no legendary below 6k and so on).
The main problem is not fusing in CW but for new players at low PS where relative advantage is much higher - once you are past the gates of PvP hell you can start dealing with it. I have almost no fused items and usually prefer to change my builds regularly - but it takes a storage of parts to do so.
If you are a new player with 3 vectors on a hunter cabin - you have crappy build you cant improve because you dont have the resources to build better stuff because you dont have the build to grind resources because your build sucks. It nees a “jumpstart” until you get your first couple epics and are “in the flow”.
It takes time to get into the proper building and new players should get this time - at least few 100s missions and couple months.
Thank you for pointing out the huge difference in PS range matchmaking between low PS and mid/high PS, as that is the whole reason why I suggested this.
Above 10kPS, a few hundred extra PS makes no real difference in the matchmaking, while it does make a big difference in low PS.
No experienced player should be crying about their fused low PS builds getting bumped up a few hundred PS, nor should they be worrying about a few hundred extra PS at high PS.
Veterans should have the advantage because of their skill, not because they spent more resources to get a matchmaking advantage. Experienced players already have better inventories and better structure pieces. Do we really need more advantages?
read words of others thoroughly. Kindly do not reply to my messages, any further salt (directly to my messages) from your side will be marked as spam.
Exactly this. I never cried when they nerfed my Summators. I never cried when they nerfed some of my tires. I never cried then they nerfed hovers or Seals/Shivers. I had adjusted my builds and moved on.
But what should be added along with PS bonus is the ability to either de-fuse item or choose one parameter yourself instead of random (on the first fuse). And reduce the cost of fusing, even though it would be less of a cashgrab.
